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That was a super interesting read that raised so many important points. Regarding the mentioned lack of maps of flooded areas, I wonder if volunteers were aware

That was a super interesting read that raised so many important points. Regarding the mentioned lack of maps of flooded areas, I wonder if volunteers were aware of the Copernicus EMS service activation [1]. This is a mapping team that, upon activation, constantly produces free maps of the emergency (fires, floodings, etc.) from satellite imaginery and radar data. The maps are constantly updates as soon as new satellite data is available. The most recent map [2], in fact, was uploaded just 15 minutes prior to this comment. More importantly, along each map a light vector package of the relevant GIS data [3] is published, so certainly this GIS data would be useful to add to an emergency app... As far as I know, the Hazards Data Distribution System (HDDS) of the USGS [4] also provides satellite imaginery, but I'm not sure if they also process this imaginery into freely-distributed, printable maps and vector GIS data. --- [1] http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/list-of-components/EMSR229 http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/list-of-components/EM... [2] http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/system/files/components/EMSR229_07LAFAYETTE_01DELINEATION_MAP_v1_300dpi.pdf http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/system/files/componen... [3] http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/download/146034/EMSR229_07LAFAYETTE_01DELINEATION_MAP_v1_vector.zip http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/download/146034/EMSR2... [4] https://hdds.usgs.gov/ https://hdds.usgs.gov/

hackcasual 9y ago
Seriously cool stuff. I've got relatives in Houston and was frustrated that I couldn't find an easy way to see if they were impacted
- JorgeGT 9y ago
  I think their products are really great for the general public, because not everyone knows GIS and how to access satellite imagery. In some cases, such as fires, earthquakes, etc. they even estimate the impact into buildings (affected, destroyed, etc) which is really useful for people who may be wondering if their family/property is OK. Example: http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/system/files/components/EMSR004_01FINALEEMILIA_GRADING_DETAIL02_v4_200dpi.jpg http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/system/files/componen...
maxerickson 9y ago
NOAA gathered some post event aerial imagery: https://storms.ngs.noaa.gov/storms/harvey/index.html https://storms.ngs.noaa.gov/storms/harvey/index.html It looks like USGS has most of their activity here: https://www.usgs.gov/special-topic/hurricane-harvey https://www.usgs.gov/special-topic/hurricane-harvey
- JorgeGT 9y ago
  Yep, I saw the really neat aerial imagery, and I know that in addition the USGS ingests enormous quantities of raw satellite imagery (https://twitter.com/USGS_HDDS https://twitter.com/USGS_HDDS), however most of that data is not freely available to the public, only to certain organizations. However, the main problem that I see (although I may be totally wrong!) is that all those raw data doesn't get condensed into ready-for-print maps of the affected areas, that can be distributed to volunteers on the field such as those made by Copernicus.
yourapostasy 9y ago
Thank you for bringing up Copernicus EMS and HDDS, I've added it to my observation notes. That data would be definitely be useful, but no one in the effort knew about these resources at the time. Water rescuers were given a general idea of an area that could be assumed flooded throughout, but boaters had to exercise caution at all times because of water hazards (both stationary and mobile) and flood waters could subside without warning, leaving some boats stranded on shallow mud flats. While it was somewhat life-threatening with water rescues, the lack of data could be worked around because the water rise to the point it was life-threatening was reckoned in 15-30 minute intervals, and people could coordinate rescues of rescuers around that timeframe. However, in a fire response version of such Net-based coordination, accurate, up-to-the-second assessment would be life-critical. Not sure how to address that without industrial-grade drones or even UAV's, and hella-expensive grade FLIR, and the FAA (and possibly DHS) would then be deeply involved. Not sure why UAV-based realtime GIS mapping wasn't deployed. The hardware tech exists, but perhaps the pipeline for data ingestion, cleanup, processing and publishing isn't up to realtime demands, even for a limited scope of "show me what is different from this satellite GIS map of the same area". That would be an interesting problem to solve, correcting for daylight shadows, transient objects like cars and planes, etc.; I'm sure the military intelligence folks in the IMINT sector have long since worked out the initial challenges of this problem space, but open algorithms for applying to this problem space (not to speak of code) don't seem readily available to me after searching around, so it might be a long slog up the learning curve. These disasters might be a good application of temporary air mobile vehicles supplying some form of wireless signal. If you're going to loft up a vehicle into the air to collect realtime GIS, you might as well blanket the area with an emergency wireless signal. Would have to solve problems around rate-limiting, dynamic prioritization based upon confirmed emergencies, etc. The flooding points out to me the lack of research into flood waters diversion [1]; there is still a lot we don't know about what happens when we try to mitigate excess flood waters. We know at least some flooding is necessary for managing topsoil erosion. But even the $26B estimate to bring Houston up to a more hardened flooding posture [2] seems like cheap insurance compared to the $100B estimates being thrown around now. I've wondered if it is possible, and what it would take to build a national water grid that intakes excess flood waters in one region of the nation, processes it so it is ecologically "clean" of invasive species, and shunts it to a drier region. The capacity of such an infrastructure within the channels themselves might lessen the need for designated floodwater storage plains, and simultaneously vastly increase land utilization. However, megascale infrastructure projects still seem out of our grasp in this era. [1] https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/01/160106114744.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/01/160106114744.h... [2] https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/08/how-much-does-houston-spend-on-flood-control/538257/ https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/08/how-m...

hackcasual 9y ago

Seriously cool stuff. I've got relatives in Houston and was frustrated that I couldn't find an easy way to see if they were impacted

JorgeGT 9y ago
I think their products are really great for the general public, because not everyone knows GIS and how to access satellite imagery. In some cases, such as fires, earthquakes, etc. they even estimate the impact into buildings (affected, destroyed, etc) which is really useful for people who may be wondering if their family/property is OK. Example: http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/system/files/components/EMSR004_01FINALEEMILIA_GRADING_DETAIL02_v4_200dpi.jpg http://emergency.copernicus.eu/mapping/system/files/componen...

maxerickson 9y ago

NOAA gathered some post event aerial imagery: https://storms.ngs.noaa.gov/storms/harvey/index.html https://storms.ngs.noaa.gov/storms/harvey/index.html It looks like USGS has most of their activity here: https://www.usgs.gov/special-topic/hurricane-harvey https://www.usgs.gov/special-topic/hurricane-harvey

JorgeGT 9y ago
Yep, I saw the really neat aerial imagery, and I know that in addition the USGS ingests enormous quantities of raw satellite imagery (https://twitter.com/USGS_HDDS https://twitter.com/USGS_HDDS), however most of that data is not freely available to the public, only to certain organizations. However, the main problem that I see (although I may be totally wrong!) is that all those raw data doesn't get condensed into ready-for-print maps of the affected areas, that can be distributed to volunteers on the field such as those made by Copernicus.

yourapostasy 9y ago

Thank you for bringing up Copernicus EMS and HDDS, I've added it to my observation notes. That data would be definitely be useful, but no one in the effort knew about these resources at the time. Water rescuers were given a general idea of an area that could be assumed flooded throughout, but boaters had to exercise caution at all times because of water hazards (both stationary and mobile) and flood waters could subside without warning, leaving some boats stranded on shallow mud flats. While it was somewhat life-threatening with water rescues, the lack of data could be worked around because the water rise to the point it was life-threatening was reckoned in 15-30 minute intervals, and people could coordinate rescues of rescuers around that timeframe. However, in a fire response version of such Net-based coordination, accurate, up-to-the-second assessment would be life-critical. Not sure how to address that without industrial-grade drones or even UAV's, and hella-expensive grade FLIR, and the FAA (and possibly DHS) would then be deeply involved. Not sure why UAV-based realtime GIS mapping wasn't deployed. The hardware tech exists, but perhaps the pipeline for data ingestion, cleanup, processing and publishing isn't up to realtime demands, even for a limited scope of "show me what is different from this satellite GIS map of the same area". That would be an interesting problem to solve, correcting for daylight shadows, transient objects like cars and planes, etc.; I'm sure the military intelligence folks in the IMINT sector have long since worked out the initial challenges of this problem space, but open algorithms for applying to this problem space (not to speak of code) don't seem readily available to me after searching around, so it might be a long slog up the learning curve. These disasters might be a good application of temporary air mobile vehicles supplying some form of wireless signal. If you're going to loft up a vehicle into the air to collect realtime GIS, you might as well blanket the area with an emergency wireless signal. Would have to solve problems around rate-limiting, dynamic prioritization based upon confirmed emergencies, etc. The flooding points out to me the lack of research into flood waters diversion [1]; there is still a lot we don't know about what happens when we try to mitigate excess flood waters. We know at least some flooding is necessary for managing topsoil erosion. But even the $26B estimate to bring Houston up to a more hardened flooding posture [2] seems like cheap insurance compared to the $100B estimates being thrown around now. I've wondered if it is possible, and what it would take to build a national water grid that intakes excess flood waters in one region of the nation, processes it so it is ecologically "clean" of invasive species, and shunts it to a drier region. The capacity of such an infrastructure within the channels themselves might lessen the need for designated floodwater storage plains, and simultaneously vastly increase land utilization. However, megascale infrastructure projects still seem out of our grasp in this era. [1] https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/01/160106114744.htm https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/01/160106114744.h... [2] https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/08/how-much-does-houston-spend-on-flood-control/538257/ https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/08/how-m...