4 ms·

Illegal subletting isn't breaking and entering, though. A home is ultimately the home owner's responsibility; if your tenants break the law, you're likely resp

Illegal subletting isn't breaking and entering, though. A home is ultimately the home owner's responsibility; if your tenants break the law, you're likely responsible, which is why contracts typically disallow subletting (as well as contain many other clauses to prevent putting the owner at risk). This is why absentee owners with no property manager are putting themselves at a risk, as they can't check on the tenants very easily.

cperciva 9y ago
The Airbnb customers had no legal right to be in the property in question. Maybe it's trespassing rather than breaking and entering; but they weren't legal tenants.
- lobster_johnson 9y ago
  That's still a non-sequitur. Trespassing is a criminal violation, doesn't apply here, and has nothing to do with the terms of a lease. If I'm renting an apartment from a landlord, and you visit me, are you trespassing? No, because I gave you permission. If I'm out of town and let you stay, you're still not trespassing. As a guest, you don't need the owner's permission to be present. As a guest who subleases from me, you wouldn't be violating the terms of the lease, either; I would be. The case in the article happened because a law is being broken by persons who are not legally responsible for it. This whole problem exists because anyone can create AirBnb listings, even if they don't have the right to rent it out.
- ianburrell 9y ago
  It isn't trespassing. They had the permission of the tenants. It was violation of lease but that is not a crime.
  - cperciva 9y ago
    If I give you permission to walk into the Y Combinator offices, you're still trespassing. The tenants had no ability to grant legally meaningful permission.
    - URSpider94 9y ago
      Criminal trespass doesn't work that way. For the most part, you have to have clear knowledge that you are on someone else's property without permission - for example, climbing over a fence, or walking past a "No Tresspassing" sign. If someone invites you into the Y Combinator offices and gives you the door code, you're not trespassing.
    - lobster_johnson 9y ago
      If you work at Y Combinator, then yes, you can give people permission to walk into the offices. If you don't work at YC, then you can't. But that's not what happened here. People who legally rented an apartment invited guests to live there. Nobody trespassed. But the people who sublet the apartment probably violated the terms of the lease, and caused the landlord to be in violation of Miami Beach rental laws.

cperciva 9y ago

The Airbnb customers had no legal right to be in the property in question. Maybe it's trespassing rather than breaking and entering; but they weren't legal tenants.

lobster_johnson 9y ago
That's still a non-sequitur. Trespassing is a criminal violation, doesn't apply here, and has nothing to do with the terms of a lease. If I'm renting an apartment from a landlord, and you visit me, are you trespassing? No, because I gave you permission. If I'm out of town and let you stay, you're still not trespassing. As a guest, you don't need the owner's permission to be present. As a guest who subleases from me, you wouldn't be violating the terms of the lease, either; I would be. The case in the article happened because a law is being broken by persons who are not legally responsible for it. This whole problem exists because anyone can create AirBnb listings, even if they don't have the right to rent it out.
ianburrell 9y ago
It isn't trespassing. They had the permission of the tenants. It was violation of lease but that is not a crime.
- cperciva 9y ago
  If I give you permission to walk into the Y Combinator offices, you're still trespassing. The tenants had no ability to grant legally meaningful permission.
  - URSpider94 9y ago
    Criminal trespass doesn't work that way. For the most part, you have to have clear knowledge that you are on someone else's property without permission - for example, climbing over a fence, or walking past a "No Tresspassing" sign. If someone invites you into the Y Combinator offices and gives you the door code, you're not trespassing.
  - lobster_johnson 9y ago
    If you work at Y Combinator, then yes, you can give people permission to walk into the offices. If you don't work at YC, then you can't. But that's not what happened here. People who legally rented an apartment invited guests to live there. Nobody trespassed. But the people who sublet the apartment probably violated the terms of the lease, and caused the landlord to be in violation of Miami Beach rental laws.