3 ms·

I wasn't taking about the lid. The raw thermal output is different under a full non-transient load. Why the cynism?

paulmd 9y ago
Real-world power consumption between the 6950X and the 1800X aren't supposed to be terribly different either. What did you measure before and after? https://www.bit-tech.net/reviews/tech/amd-ryzen-1800x-and-am4-platform-review/8/ https://www.bit-tech.net/reviews/tech/amd-ryzen-1800x-and-am... https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-7-1800X-Review-Now-and-Zen/Power-Consumption-and-Conclusions https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-7-1800X-R... > Why the cynism? Because in performance and efficiency Ryzen is basically equivalent with Haswell-E/Broadwell-E. The sole advantage it has is that the 8C Ryzens are cheaper than the 8C and 10C Intel SKUs (the 6C have been competitive for a long time), and the tradeoff is you are moving to a much more immature platform. Claims like "oh my Ryzen was so much cooler than my 6950X" set off my bullshit detector real hard because that's not what the people who are actually measuring things are saying. They usually end up being made on the basis of the TDP figures, which AMD's marketing department has massaged significantly downwards from their actual measurements. Ryzen is basically on par with Haswell, it's not the second coming of Jesus unless you've been in a coma since Bulldozer was released.
- quickben 9y ago
  http://www.anandtech.com/show/9959/samsung-announces-14lpp-mass-production http://www.anandtech.com/show/9959/samsung-announces-14lpp-m... https://semiaccurate.com/2016/09/01/intel-finally-narrows-14nm-process-technology-gap-samsung/ https://semiaccurate.com/2016/09/01/intel-finally-narrows-14...
  - paulmd 9y ago
    I think you might have forgotten to type a post to go with those links. Later iterations of Ryzen are undoubtedly going to fix some of the teething issues (segfaults, memory clocks, etc), and probably get the clocks up too. But they will also be going up against Coffee Lake and others - Intel can iterate on their products too. Consumer Ryzen is basically just Haswell with an AMD sticker on it, and it's just so transparently fake to see all the fanboys cooing over a product they wouldn't even give the time of day to when it was released under an Intel badge. It's an incremental improvement on pricing, but not really that drastic except in a few special cases (the 8C and 10C Intel processors had very steep pricing). As it's on a newer stepping with a better platform and fully-validated ECC support, Epyc is much more interesting product to me. But it's also a market that doesn't care about throwing money at the problem if that's what it takes to get performance/stability - there are plenty of companies who are not even using COTS hardware let alone off-brand. Also, bear in mind that "nm" measurements are pure marketing. It's now the spacing between features that determines total density, not feature size. Intel is at least a full node ahead of everyone else in density, even if others claim to have "14nm" nodes.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
temac 9y ago
If you change the thermal resistance, you can very well overheat or not with the same constant TDP.

Real-world power consumption between the 6950X and the 1800X aren't supposed to be terribly different either. What did you measure before and after? https://www.bit-tech.net/reviews/tech/amd-ryzen-1800x-and-am4-platform-review/8/ https://www.bit-tech.net/reviews/tech/amd-ryzen-1800x-and-am... https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-7-1800X-Review-Now-and-Zen/Power-Consumption-and-Conclusions https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/AMD-Ryzen-7-1800X-R... > Why the cynism? Because in performance and efficiency Ryzen is basically equivalent with Haswell-E/Broadwell-E. The sole advantage it has is that the 8C Ryzens are cheaper than the 8C and 10C Intel SKUs (the 6C have been competitive for a long time), and the tradeoff is you are moving to a much more immature platform. Claims like "oh my Ryzen was so much cooler than my 6950X" set off my bullshit detector real hard because that's not what the people who are actually measuring things are saying. They usually end up being made on the basis of the TDP figures, which AMD's marketing department has massaged significantly downwards from their actual measurements. Ryzen is basically on par with Haswell, it's not the second coming of Jesus unless you've been in a coma since Bulldozer was released.

quickben 9y ago
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9959/samsung-announces-14lpp-mass-production http://www.anandtech.com/show/9959/samsung-announces-14lpp-m... https://semiaccurate.com/2016/09/01/intel-finally-narrows-14nm-process-technology-gap-samsung/ https://semiaccurate.com/2016/09/01/intel-finally-narrows-14...
- paulmd 9y ago
  I think you might have forgotten to type a post to go with those links. Later iterations of Ryzen are undoubtedly going to fix some of the teething issues (segfaults, memory clocks, etc), and probably get the clocks up too. But they will also be going up against Coffee Lake and others - Intel can iterate on their products too. Consumer Ryzen is basically just Haswell with an AMD sticker on it, and it's just so transparently fake to see all the fanboys cooing over a product they wouldn't even give the time of day to when it was released under an Intel badge. It's an incremental improvement on pricing, but not really that drastic except in a few special cases (the 8C and 10C Intel processors had very steep pricing). As it's on a newer stepping with a better platform and fully-validated ECC support, Epyc is much more interesting product to me. But it's also a market that doesn't care about throwing money at the problem if that's what it takes to get performance/stability - there are plenty of companies who are not even using COTS hardware let alone off-brand. Also, bear in mind that "nm" measurements are pure marketing. It's now the spacing between features that determines total density, not feature size. Intel is at least a full node ahead of everyone else in density, even if others claim to have "14nm" nodes.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]

temac 9y ago

If you change the thermal resistance, you can very well overheat or not with the same constant TDP.