5 ms·

Lie with dogs, get fleas. Joey Gibson has repeatedly embraced some truly horrible people in Portland, and claims ignorance when he is met with fury. He's a pr

by nyargh 9y ago

Lie with dogs, get fleas. Joey Gibson has repeatedly embraced some truly horrible people in Portland, and claims ignorance when he is met with fury. He's a provocateur and knows exactly what he is doing. For example, Allen Pucket, a frequent speaker at his local rallies: http://rosecityantifa.org/articles/allen-pucket/ http://rosecityantifa.org/articles/allen-pucket/ This guy has been a fixture in Portland for years, but entered national prominence when he showed up to scream at brown people at the Portland airport after Trump's first visa ban. He regularly harasses pride marchers in Portland, stands outside gay bars with a megaphone to harass patrons, but he managed to find a friend in Joey Gibson's Patriot Prayer - all in the name of Freeze Peach, of course. SSDD

ipsocannibal 9y ago
It seems to me you are promoting guilt by association while condoning extrajudicial violence by masked vigilantes against those exercising their constitutionally protected rights. Or did I miss something?
- nyargh 9y ago
  I'd say that you missed everything. I'm missing why this gushing apologia for a provocateur like Gibson is on HN in the first place.
  - ipsocannibal 9y ago
    And yet you haven't pointed out what I've missed. Are you or are you not condoning extrajudicial violence by masked vigilantes? Simple question, a yes or no will suffice. Also asking a simple question is far from "gushing apologia" but it seems blatant miss characterization is something with which you are quite familiar.
    - nyargh 9y ago
      I was referring to the submitted article, which gushed all over Gibson and pals - not your attempt at reductio. For some reason I fail to get the vapors when a bunch of people whose mission it is to incite (and occasionally enact) violence against minorities get punched. In Berkeley, no less. I might add that Joey Gibson fared a lot better after that encounter than the numerous victims of gaybashing, pogroms, lynching or police brutality have. A question for you, "What decisions did I make in my life that lead me to defend white supremacists?". No matter how you may try to characterize it, there is nothing noble about that position.
- MrZongle2 9y ago
  That was my interpretation as well. This is the result of the line of thinking that goes from "we're against bad people" to "those who don't agree with us are bad people" to "it's OK to punch bad people". Antifa have become the very thing they supposedly oppose.
  - nyargh 9y ago
    > Antifa have become the very thing they supposedly oppose. You know the funny thing about Antifa? They would cease to exist if these aspiring fascists stopped supporting violence (direct or state-sponsored) against minority communities. You can't say the opposite is true. This attempt at moral equivalence is weak, weak, weak. Joey Gibson loudly, proudly aligns with fascist white nationalists and gaybashers, goes to liberal enclaves to provoke (er... "trigger" -- in his words) and gets punched. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Despite all the Freeze Peach winging that goes on here - "Fighting Words" are an important limitation of that right in the 'States. Gibson walks hand-in-hand with those who regularly threaten violence and intimidate minorities. There is no "both sides-ism" on this issue in civil society. You can't simultaneously support those who terrorize American minorities and claim you are supporting our nation's ideals. The math isn't that difficult here. EDIT: And before you drag the ACLU into this as a counterexample a) they have a solid track record of defending all sides - where Gibson clearly has an agenda to provoke one side and b) they have drawn the line at defending armed protest after the shit show in Charlottesville.
    - krapp 9y ago
      >They would cease to exist if these aspiring fascists stopped supporting violence (direct or state-sponsored) against minority communities. They would have to be a surprisingly disciplined bunch of radicals were that to be the case.
      - nyargh 9y ago
        > They would have to be a surprisingly disciplined bunch of radicals were that to be the case. True, white supremacists don't exactly have a great history of non-violence.

by nyargh 9y ago

ipsocannibal 9y ago

It seems to me you are promoting guilt by association while condoning extrajudicial violence by masked vigilantes against those exercising their constitutionally protected rights. Or did I miss something?

nyargh 9y ago
I'd say that you missed everything. I'm missing why this gushing apologia for a provocateur like Gibson is on HN in the first place.
- ipsocannibal 9y ago
  And yet you haven't pointed out what I've missed. Are you or are you not condoning extrajudicial violence by masked vigilantes? Simple question, a yes or no will suffice. Also asking a simple question is far from "gushing apologia" but it seems blatant miss characterization is something with which you are quite familiar.
  - nyargh 9y ago
    I was referring to the submitted article, which gushed all over Gibson and pals - not your attempt at reductio. For some reason I fail to get the vapors when a bunch of people whose mission it is to incite (and occasionally enact) violence against minorities get punched. In Berkeley, no less. I might add that Joey Gibson fared a lot better after that encounter than the numerous victims of gaybashing, pogroms, lynching or police brutality have. A question for you, "What decisions did I make in my life that lead me to defend white supremacists?". No matter how you may try to characterize it, there is nothing noble about that position.
MrZongle2 9y ago
That was my interpretation as well. This is the result of the line of thinking that goes from "we're against bad people" to "those who don't agree with us are bad people" to "it's OK to punch bad people". Antifa have become the very thing they supposedly oppose.
- nyargh 9y ago
  > Antifa have become the very thing they supposedly oppose. You know the funny thing about Antifa? They would cease to exist if these aspiring fascists stopped supporting violence (direct or state-sponsored) against minority communities. You can't say the opposite is true. This attempt at moral equivalence is weak, weak, weak. Joey Gibson loudly, proudly aligns with fascist white nationalists and gaybashers, goes to liberal enclaves to provoke (er... "trigger" -- in his words) and gets punched. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Despite all the Freeze Peach winging that goes on here - "Fighting Words" are an important limitation of that right in the 'States. Gibson walks hand-in-hand with those who regularly threaten violence and intimidate minorities. There is no "both sides-ism" on this issue in civil society. You can't simultaneously support those who terrorize American minorities and claim you are supporting our nation's ideals. The math isn't that difficult here. EDIT: And before you drag the ACLU into this as a counterexample a) they have a solid track record of defending all sides - where Gibson clearly has an agenda to provoke one side and b) they have drawn the line at defending armed protest after the shit show in Charlottesville.
  - krapp 9y ago
    >They would cease to exist if these aspiring fascists stopped supporting violence (direct or state-sponsored) against minority communities. They would have to be a surprisingly disciplined bunch of radicals were that to be the case.
    - nyargh 9y ago
      > They would have to be a surprisingly disciplined bunch of radicals were that to be the case. True, white supremacists don't exactly have a great history of non-violence.