>true but I don't see a whole lot on that front in the JVM world either. There's a few libraries that pop up here and there, but most Java work I've ever seen i

>true but I don't see a whole lot on that front in the JVM world either. There's a few libraries that pop up here and there, but most Java work I've ever seen is done using existing tools and frameworks, unfortunately. I still don't understand what the problem here is. Can you explain a concrete business problem you were trying to solve and found Clojure inadequate for. What was the scenario where you couldn't find a library for a specific task, or couldn't solve a problem because the language was deficient. >I look at it the other way around: In an incredibly short time span, NPM has pretty much covered every library that the JVM has. Threads is a great example of something that Java has and makes a huge difference in the developer experience. Having to chain async calls for every single thing you do is absolutely insane in my experience. Following code becomes a lot harder, debugging is a nightmare, and passing errors around has to be done explicitly in error prone fashion. >From a technical perspective, Node is probably inferior to JVM in most ways, yeah. But not in ways that matter significantly. See above. >Lately I've been considering social aspects to be a lot more important than technical aspects, though. Sure, let's talk about social aspects. Clojure community is primarily composed of very experienced developers and that directly reflects the quality of tooling and libraries available. Last I checked Clojure community is very active and it's not going anywhere. It's used at places like Amazon, Boeing, NASA, and Walmart for mission critical tasks. I certainly value quality over quantity here.