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> and that he believes he should use Google and his wealth to intentionally seek to manipulate modern culture. It's a disturbing notion and I've never understoo

by xienze 9y ago

> and that he believes he should use Google and his wealth to intentionally seek to manipulate modern culture. It's a disturbing notion and I've never understood why people weren't more concerned about it. Because they're pushing the progressive agenda, so who in the media, government, or academia is going to stand in their way? As far as those parties are concerned, Google is doing what corporations "should" do.

sangnoir 9y ago
> Because they're pushing the progressive agenda I would say Shmidt's agenda is more neo-liberal than progressive. Not that I endorse it, but corporations pushing an agenda is not new[1] and not limited to the left[2][3], so not even conservative media will stand in their way either since that has been happening for a long time on the right. 1. http://www.prwatch.org/news/2013/12/12338/shilling-profit-case-study-alecs-campaign-against-divestment-apartheid-south http://www.prwatch.org/news/2013/12/12338/shilling-profit-ca... 2. http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hobby-lobby-wins-contraceptive-ruling-supreme-court/story?id=24364311 http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hobby-lobby-wins-contraceptiv... 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chick-fil-A_same-sex_marriage_controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chick-fil-A_same-sex_marriage_...
- WillPostForFood 9y ago
  Hobby Lobby and Chick-fil-A aren't out sending hundreds of millions financing think tanks and lobbyists in Washington, they are just trying to run their own business with their own agenda. And the scale of the companies are orders of magnitude smaller than Google, both are medium sized family owned businesses.
  - r00fus 9y ago
    Clearly this is just "business" [1]. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/28/hobby-lobby-investigated-ancient-artifacts-iraq https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/28/hobby-lobby-...
    - WillPostForFood 9y ago
      It is ok not to like Hobby Lobby or their owners, but explain how you think that is relevant to "corporations pushing an agenda."
  - root_axis 9y ago
    > Hobby Lobby and Chick-fil-A aren't out sending hundreds of millions financing think tanks and lobbyists in Washington Why would they? Washington is already controlled by people who share their ideology.
  - DerekL 9y ago
    Chick-fil-A is much smaller than Google, but they were funding think tanks and lobbyists, until boycotts convinced them to stop.
mehwahnah999 9y ago
Exactly this. If I have a political religion, it's Chomskican. Chomskicrat? He describes exactly this over and over. The protectors of the ideology control our universities, training good little corporate bots. They're getting pats on the back from early on to tow the line regarding economics, neoliberal policies, fancy jobs, nice things, for doing so. Success isn't measured by merit, but by how successful you are evangelizing the gospel of America's form of mercantilism. A whole lot of today's most successful haven't built anything humanity will rely on in a generation. Facebook in 2100? Please. They know how to peddle brand! Facebook allows you to do something you've never done before! WOW! No one questions whether that thing is really valuable in any meaningful way. So far, the spying/tracking, propagation of propaganda, effectively TV on the web brainless distraction, seems to suggest that overall, no, social media is more of America 1980 style. Not a huge shock, most of the folks at these corps learned in universities keen to push out good workers, who learned in 1980s economies. Nostalgia forever. Tradition rules all in America, despite our facade of "progress". Everyone wants the world to look like it did in their head when they were kids.
quickben 9y ago
What's so progressive about censorship and why are you glorifying it?
- WillPostForFood 9y ago
  I wouldn't ask what's so progressive about censorship, but why have progressives seemingly embraced it? or at least distanced themselves from a more firm defense of free speech.
  - frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
    Which progressives have embraced censorship?
    - zzzeek 9y ago
      parent poster is likely referring to the right to sit in your office all day spouting pseduoscientific essays on why 20% of your coworkers probably should not be working in the job they have.
      - hueving 9y ago
        Or antifa which is keen on violence to make nazis stop spreading their ideology.
    - WillPostForFood 9y ago
      https://qz.com/1053957/charlottesville-neo-nazis-and-the-case-against-free-speech-for-fascists/ https://qz.com/1053957/charlottesville-neo-nazis-and-the-cas... I think this article is a good encapsulation of the progressive ambivalence on free speech, which has provided a rationale for violence against speakers like Charles Murray (https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/03/middlebury-free-speech-violence/518667/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/03/middleb...), the violent protests that have followed Milo Yiannopoulos, and "safe spaces" on college campuses.
drewbuschhorn 9y ago
Where are these praise Google for its liberalism stories? Prior to Trumpism and the breakdown of modern politics, the only time I really heard people talking about how wonderful it was that Google was liberal was the occasional fluff piece about their solar programs. So where are the stories of senators saying, "those guys at Google, they're what we should be striving for." As opposed to senators raking them over the coals (rightly) for tax avoidance.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
abiox 9y ago
> Because they're pushing the progressive agenda, so who in the media, government, or academia is going to stand in their way? Well, the media largely only cares for agendas that fit their advertiser's preferences. Their advertiser's preferences are dictated by what they think will help their business... they're not particularly concerned with the nature of any particular agenda, only whether an agenda benefits them. The government is the largely similar, but rather than advertisers it's political parties balancing appeal to their donors, lobbyists and other powers. To a minor degree also to their base, but hand-waving and obscurantism tends to limit this need. Academia increasingly does seem pretty screwed up (STEM isn't free of issues, but the really nutty stuff is mostly in the 'humanities'). I suspect firing Damore will probably sate their blood-lust for a while.

by xienze 9y ago

sangnoir 9y ago

> Because they're pushing the progressive agenda I would say Shmidt's agenda is more neo-liberal than progressive. Not that I endorse it, but corporations pushing an agenda is not new[1] and not limited to the left[2][3], so not even conservative media will stand in their way either since that has been happening for a long time on the right. 1. http://www.prwatch.org/news/2013/12/12338/shilling-profit-case-study-alecs-campaign-against-divestment-apartheid-south http://www.prwatch.org/news/2013/12/12338/shilling-profit-ca... 2. http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hobby-lobby-wins-contraceptive-ruling-supreme-court/story?id=24364311 http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hobby-lobby-wins-contraceptiv... 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chick-fil-A_same-sex_marriage_controversy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chick-fil-A_same-sex_marriage_...

WillPostForFood 9y ago
Hobby Lobby and Chick-fil-A aren't out sending hundreds of millions financing think tanks and lobbyists in Washington, they are just trying to run their own business with their own agenda. And the scale of the companies are orders of magnitude smaller than Google, both are medium sized family owned businesses.
- r00fus 9y ago
  Clearly this is just "business" [1]. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/28/hobby-lobby-investigated-ancient-artifacts-iraq https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/28/hobby-lobby-...
  - WillPostForFood 9y ago
    It is ok not to like Hobby Lobby or their owners, but explain how you think that is relevant to "corporations pushing an agenda."
- root_axis 9y ago
  > Hobby Lobby and Chick-fil-A aren't out sending hundreds of millions financing think tanks and lobbyists in Washington Why would they? Washington is already controlled by people who share their ideology.
- DerekL 9y ago
  Chick-fil-A is much smaller than Google, but they were funding think tanks and lobbyists, until boycotts convinced them to stop.

mehwahnah999 9y ago

Exactly this. If I have a political religion, it's Chomskican. Chomskicrat? He describes exactly this over and over. The protectors of the ideology control our universities, training good little corporate bots. They're getting pats on the back from early on to tow the line regarding economics, neoliberal policies, fancy jobs, nice things, for doing so. Success isn't measured by merit, but by how successful you are evangelizing the gospel of America's form of mercantilism. A whole lot of today's most successful haven't built anything humanity will rely on in a generation. Facebook in 2100? Please. They know how to peddle brand! Facebook allows you to do something you've never done before! WOW! No one questions whether that thing is really valuable in any meaningful way. So far, the spying/tracking, propagation of propaganda, effectively TV on the web brainless distraction, seems to suggest that overall, no, social media is more of America 1980 style. Not a huge shock, most of the folks at these corps learned in universities keen to push out good workers, who learned in 1980s economies. Nostalgia forever. Tradition rules all in America, despite our facade of "progress". Everyone wants the world to look like it did in their head when they were kids.

quickben 9y ago

What's so progressive about censorship and why are you glorifying it?

WillPostForFood 9y ago
I wouldn't ask what's so progressive about censorship, but why have progressives seemingly embraced it? or at least distanced themselves from a more firm defense of free speech.
- frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
  Which progressives have embraced censorship?
  - zzzeek 9y ago
    parent poster is likely referring to the right to sit in your office all day spouting pseduoscientific essays on why 20% of your coworkers probably should not be working in the job they have.
    - hueving 9y ago
      Or antifa which is keen on violence to make nazis stop spreading their ideology.
  - WillPostForFood 9y ago
    https://qz.com/1053957/charlottesville-neo-nazis-and-the-case-against-free-speech-for-fascists/ https://qz.com/1053957/charlottesville-neo-nazis-and-the-cas... I think this article is a good encapsulation of the progressive ambivalence on free speech, which has provided a rationale for violence against speakers like Charles Murray (https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/03/middlebury-free-speech-violence/518667/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/03/middleb...), the violent protests that have followed Milo Yiannopoulos, and "safe spaces" on college campuses.

drewbuschhorn 9y ago

Where are these praise Google for its liberalism stories? Prior to Trumpism and the breakdown of modern politics, the only time I really heard people talking about how wonderful it was that Google was liberal was the occasional fluff piece about their solar programs. So where are the stories of senators saying, "those guys at Google, they're what we should be striving for." As opposed to senators raking them over the coals (rightly) for tax avoidance.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

abiox 9y ago

> Because they're pushing the progressive agenda, so who in the media, government, or academia is going to stand in their way? Well, the media largely only cares for agendas that fit their advertiser's preferences. Their advertiser's preferences are dictated by what they think will help their business... they're not particularly concerned with the nature of any particular agenda, only whether an agenda benefits them. The government is the largely similar, but rather than advertisers it's political parties balancing appeal to their donors, lobbyists and other powers. To a minor degree also to their base, but hand-waving and obscurantism tends to limit this need. Academia increasingly does seem pretty screwed up (STEM isn't free of issues, but the really nutty stuff is mostly in the 'humanities'). I suspect firing Damore will probably sate their blood-lust for a while.