4 ms·

But... what about step 2? > Like a building full of PhD's advanced. On a more serious note, it's unfortunate that so many smart people use their intelligence

by md224 9y ago

But... what about step 2? > Like a building full of PhD's advanced. On a more serious note, it's unfortunate that so many smart people use their intelligence to enable this kind of gross technology. It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. There's gotta be more productive ways to advance your career.

NumberCruncher 9y ago
Selling stuff is a better business than making the world a better place: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI8AMRbqY6w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI8AMRbqY6w
NTDF9 9y ago
Whatever made you think that tech industry is a beacon symbolizing all the good things about humanity!
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
Razengan 9y ago
> It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. I'd figure it's more about getting paid. Making the world better usually doesn't make anyone money, or at least, costs too much before it starts making anyone money. Making the world truly better requires us to give up a lot of what gets ingrained into us since childhood. We've made money an ends instead of a means. I'm not making a political statement – this is true of every human society, culture and country today. We should collectively rethink what it means to be a successful human and have a fulfilling life (without abandoning technology and progress.) What's the end goal of civilization? Are we to just multiply and expand, ad infinitum?
- mariushn 9y ago
  >> It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. >I'd figure it's more about getting paid. Making the world better usually doesn't make anyone money, or at least, costs too much before it starts making anyone money. This. I get paid (a lot) for handling marketing campaigns. I also started a health project this year (would love to work on it fulltime on a 10% payment vs what I make now), but that gets ignored.
chb 9y ago
The banality of evil. So many engineers just want to make the trains run on time with a better algorithm. Never mind that they cary oil or weapons or the victims of our next genocide. Engrossing technical problems are convenient blinders for inconvenient truths.
- NumberCruncher 9y ago
  The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
- rangibaby 9y ago
  But maybe for all of us there is something about what the Germans did that pleases and excites us-something that opens the catacombs of the imagination. Maybe part of our dread and horror comes from a secret knowledge that under the right-or wrong-set of circumstances, we ourselves would be willing to build such places and staff them. Black serendipity. Maybe we know that under the right set of circumstances the things that live in the catacombs would be glad to crawl out And what do you think they would look like? Like mad fuehrers with forelocks and shoe-polish moustaches, heiling all over the place? Like red devils, or demons, or the dragon that floats on its stinking reptile wings?' 'I don't know,' Richler said. 'I think most of them would look like ordinary accountants,' Weiskopf said. 'Little mind-men with graphs and flow-charts and electronic calculators, all ready to start maximizing the kill ratios so that next time we could perhaps kill twenty or thirty millions instead of only seven or eight or twelve. Excerpt From: King, Stephen. “Different Seasons.”
- eeZah7Ux 9y ago
  You can't tell in advance what trains, in general, will carry. When writing ad targeting code, user surveillance, nuclear missile guidance, VW pollution test circumvention code... you know exactly what is going on.
  - kbart 9y ago
    Not necessarily. I don't know much details about other technologies you have mentioned, but user surveillance has many overlapping technologies with IT security: deep packet inspection, network flows monitoring, white/black listing etc. can be used for both good and evil and switched in-between quite easily. I'm very pro-privacy and sometimes get to work with such technologies, though I emphasize that what I do is strictly for security purpose only.
Angostura 9y ago
I suppose it depends on whether you think that Facebook is a worthwhile product that should be commercially viable, rather than closing. If you do think that, you are making the the world a better place for some values of better and world.
a13n 9y ago
> it's unfortunate that so many smart people use their intelligence to enable this kind of gross technology We live in a capitalist society. It just so happens that this "gross technology" makes advertising insanely profitable for millions of companies (mine included), which makes FB billions, so they'll happily pay really smart people millions to build it. And those smart people will happily accept millions to solve those hard problems. It's just business. If you can figure out how to better align individual and corporate incentives with making the world a better place, we're all ears.
- Grustaf 9y ago
  It's unfortunate, not surprising.
- muzuq 9y ago
  >We live in a capitalist society. Always a solid cop-out for allowing bad things to continue
yogrish 9y ago
I completely agree. I pity those PhD's using their Intellect for increasing Ad revenues to FB rather than creating/using algos to solve the pressing real-world problems - Diseases, Nutrition,Drought predictions,Curb terrorism etc. Are they even motivated by what they are doing..after all money is not everything (I agree FB pays a bomb).
- kennethh 9y ago
  I can understand the feeling, but it might seem wasted but Facebook and Google have actually made it easier for small business to do business by enabling them to get segmented customers more easily by breaking down barriers for entry. 20 years ago one could not as a small company get US or global reach without using a lot of money and it was not easy (possible) to segment either. This again have increased competition and enabled new products an lower prices. The technologies pioneered by Google and Facebook (BigData, NoSql, ML) have again improved other disciplines and fields.
  - dhimes 9y ago
    While true, I feel like they shouldn't break down all the barriers. They were helping small business do business before re-targeting. Just giving us an affordable way to get in front of interested prospects was huge.
kristianc 9y ago
>> It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. How many people do go into computer engineering with an idea of making the world a better place? Don't misunderstand me, I'm sure many computer engineers are nice, socially conscious people, but if your primary motivation in life is to make the world a better place through your work, there are many more direct ways to achieve this. It's telling that the Gates Foundation, which has enormous resources, and which could build, should it so wish, the world's best-funded 'change the world with code' startup, instead chooses to allocate its resources on physical things such as malaria drugs.

by md224 9y ago

NumberCruncher 9y ago

Selling stuff is a better business than making the world a better place: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI8AMRbqY6w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JI8AMRbqY6w

NTDF9 9y ago

Whatever made you think that tech industry is a beacon symbolizing all the good things about humanity!

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

Razengan 9y ago

> It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. I'd figure it's more about getting paid. Making the world better usually doesn't make anyone money, or at least, costs too much before it starts making anyone money. Making the world truly better requires us to give up a lot of what gets ingrained into us since childhood. We've made money an ends instead of a means. I'm not making a political statement – this is true of every human society, culture and country today. We should collectively rethink what it means to be a successful human and have a fulfilling life (without abandoning technology and progress.) What's the end goal of civilization? Are we to just multiply and expand, ad infinitum?

mariushn 9y ago
>> It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. >I'd figure it's more about getting paid. Making the world better usually doesn't make anyone money, or at least, costs too much before it starts making anyone money. This. I get paid (a lot) for handling marketing campaigns. I also started a health project this year (would love to work on it fulltime on a 10% payment vs what I make now), but that gets ignored.

chb 9y ago

The banality of evil. So many engineers just want to make the trains run on time with a better algorithm. Never mind that they cary oil or weapons or the victims of our next genocide. Engrossing technical problems are convenient blinders for inconvenient truths.

NumberCruncher 9y ago
The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
rangibaby 9y ago
But maybe for all of us there is something about what the Germans did that pleases and excites us-something that opens the catacombs of the imagination. Maybe part of our dread and horror comes from a secret knowledge that under the right-or wrong-set of circumstances, we ourselves would be willing to build such places and staff them. Black serendipity. Maybe we know that under the right set of circumstances the things that live in the catacombs would be glad to crawl out And what do you think they would look like? Like mad fuehrers with forelocks and shoe-polish moustaches, heiling all over the place? Like red devils, or demons, or the dragon that floats on its stinking reptile wings?' 'I don't know,' Richler said. 'I think most of them would look like ordinary accountants,' Weiskopf said. 'Little mind-men with graphs and flow-charts and electronic calculators, all ready to start maximizing the kill ratios so that next time we could perhaps kill twenty or thirty millions instead of only seven or eight or twelve. Excerpt From: King, Stephen. “Different Seasons.”
eeZah7Ux 9y ago
You can't tell in advance what trains, in general, will carry. When writing ad targeting code, user surveillance, nuclear missile guidance, VW pollution test circumvention code... you know exactly what is going on.
- kbart 9y ago
  Not necessarily. I don't know much details about other technologies you have mentioned, but user surveillance has many overlapping technologies with IT security: deep packet inspection, network flows monitoring, white/black listing etc. can be used for both good and evil and switched in-between quite easily. I'm very pro-privacy and sometimes get to work with such technologies, though I emphasize that what I do is strictly for security purpose only.

Angostura 9y ago

I suppose it depends on whether you think that Facebook is a worthwhile product that should be commercially viable, rather than closing. If you do think that, you are making the the world a better place for some values of better and world.

a13n 9y ago

> it's unfortunate that so many smart people use their intelligence to enable this kind of gross technology We live in a capitalist society. It just so happens that this "gross technology" makes advertising insanely profitable for millions of companies (mine included), which makes FB billions, so they'll happily pay really smart people millions to build it. And those smart people will happily accept millions to solve those hard problems. It's just business. If you can figure out how to better align individual and corporate incentives with making the world a better place, we're all ears.

Grustaf 9y ago
It's unfortunate, not surprising.
muzuq 9y ago
>We live in a capitalist society. Always a solid cop-out for allowing bad things to continue

yogrish 9y ago

I completely agree. I pity those PhD's using their Intellect for increasing Ad revenues to FB rather than creating/using algos to solve the pressing real-world problems - Diseases, Nutrition,Drought predictions,Curb terrorism etc. Are they even motivated by what they are doing..after all money is not everything (I agree FB pays a bomb).

kennethh 9y ago
I can understand the feeling, but it might seem wasted but Facebook and Google have actually made it easier for small business to do business by enabling them to get segmented customers more easily by breaking down barriers for entry. 20 years ago one could not as a small company get US or global reach without using a lot of money and it was not easy (possible) to segment either. This again have increased competition and enabled new products an lower prices. The technologies pioneered by Google and Facebook (BigData, NoSql, ML) have again improved other disciplines and fields.
- dhimes 9y ago
  While true, I feel like they shouldn't break down all the barriers. They were helping small business do business before re-targeting. Just giving us an affordable way to get in front of interested prospects was huge.

kristianc 9y ago

>> It's all about "solving puzzles" rather than making the world a better place. How many people do go into computer engineering with an idea of making the world a better place? Don't misunderstand me, I'm sure many computer engineers are nice, socially conscious people, but if your primary motivation in life is to make the world a better place through your work, there are many more direct ways to achieve this. It's telling that the Gates Foundation, which has enormous resources, and which could build, should it so wish, the world's best-funded 'change the world with code' startup, instead chooses to allocate its resources on physical things such as malaria drugs.