4 ms·

I think the point of the guys blog post / rant is not so much the price in general, but that he felt the product targetted at the start-up community. Not that I

I think the point of the guys blog post / rant is not so much the price in general, but that he felt the product targetted at the start-up community. Not that I have taken too much notice but I was under the impression that is where they were targetting it and I wouldn't be surprised if most of their beta testers were from that community and expecting the $10 per month pricing that they are more familiar with. Personally I would never create a business that targetted other businesses that really have no money, it has never seemed a great business plan, but I would not do a beta marketing of "hey you, try this, you'll love it" to then offer a product they cannot afford. I'm sure they will have no problems finding customers, but more of a problem finding beta testers for their next product.

tptacek 16y ago
You realize you're responding to a solo founder of a standalone startup that sells bingo card creation software, right? I have mad respect for Patrick (he's sitting right next to me at the moment), but if you were under the impression that being a Bingo Card Mogul meant Cristal and Rolex watches, uh, no. How much more credible a testimonial can you get than "I built my business in 5 hours a week, I sell bingo cards to school teachers, and I easily expect to recoup the investment I'm making in KISSmetrics"? For what it's worth: I sell enterprise software at a price point several orders of magnitude higher than Patrick's, at a company with more employees than most established YC companies, and KISSmetrics isn't worth it for me right now, because I'm simply not prepared to feed it the data it needs or to make the decisions it's expecting me to make. I don't take it personally that KISSmetrics is pricing me away from paying for it. In fact, I appreciate it; it's preventing me from wasting time.
- AmberShah 16y ago
  I don't think they can't charge that, nor find customers happily willing to pay it. The issue is that if you're going to break from the norm in your industry (and analytics for startup companies, oh yes, they did) then it would be nice to give people a heads up before reeling them in for a free beta. In this example, the guy actually invested time writing code to integrate with it. There's a learning curve associated with beta testing a product and without giving any indication of price ahead of time, it's a reasonable assumption that it will be ballpark what it's competitors are, not 10X that. This is not a complaint about the price they chose, it's a complaint about spending a great deal of time and money marketing to startups (god, did I see them everywhere) and then flipping to a point where they could not afford them. I do believe that someone who has made his money not off a disruptive product or social media network, but carefully analyzing metrics and conversions (like Patrick) could benefit from it, and perhaps that's who it's for, but that's not how it was marketed. In his case, he clearly feels he can make > $200 a month by using it. But what if it cost $1000 or $1M? The point is you have no idea and they clearly aren't concerned with ballparking where there competitors are. I've always been nervous about signing up for a "free" beta that my business can become dependent on without knowing the price. This just convinces me to continue doing that.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
  - tptacek 16y ago
    I actually don't have a lot of opinions about funnel tracking, so I'll keep this simple and limit it to what I do have an opinion about: If $200/mo is a lot of money to you, you either shouldn't be spending a lot of time on funnel tracking, or you don't have a business. $200/mo is below the noise floor in company with just four people at ramen wages in the Bay Area.

tptacek 16y ago

You realize you're responding to a solo founder of a standalone startup that sells bingo card creation software, right? I have mad respect for Patrick (he's sitting right next to me at the moment), but if you were under the impression that being a Bingo Card Mogul meant Cristal and Rolex watches, uh, no. How much more credible a testimonial can you get than "I built my business in 5 hours a week, I sell bingo cards to school teachers, and I easily expect to recoup the investment I'm making in KISSmetrics"? For what it's worth: I sell enterprise software at a price point several orders of magnitude higher than Patrick's, at a company with more employees than most established YC companies, and KISSmetrics isn't worth it for me right now, because I'm simply not prepared to feed it the data it needs or to make the decisions it's expecting me to make. I don't take it personally that KISSmetrics is pricing me away from paying for it. In fact, I appreciate it; it's preventing me from wasting time.

AmberShah 16y ago
I don't think they can't charge that, nor find customers happily willing to pay it. The issue is that if you're going to break from the norm in your industry (and analytics for startup companies, oh yes, they did) then it would be nice to give people a heads up before reeling them in for a free beta. In this example, the guy actually invested time writing code to integrate with it. There's a learning curve associated with beta testing a product and without giving any indication of price ahead of time, it's a reasonable assumption that it will be ballpark what it's competitors are, not 10X that. This is not a complaint about the price they chose, it's a complaint about spending a great deal of time and money marketing to startups (god, did I see them everywhere) and then flipping to a point where they could not afford them. I do believe that someone who has made his money not off a disruptive product or social media network, but carefully analyzing metrics and conversions (like Patrick) could benefit from it, and perhaps that's who it's for, but that's not how it was marketed. In his case, he clearly feels he can make > $200 a month by using it. But what if it cost $1000 or $1M? The point is you have no idea and they clearly aren't concerned with ballparking where there competitors are. I've always been nervous about signing up for a "free" beta that my business can become dependent on without knowing the price. This just convinces me to continue doing that.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
- tptacek 16y ago
  I actually don't have a lot of opinions about funnel tracking, so I'll keep this simple and limit it to what I do have an opinion about: If $200/mo is a lot of money to you, you either shouldn't be spending a lot of time on funnel tracking, or you don't have a business. $200/mo is below the noise floor in company with just four people at ramen wages in the Bay Area.