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> People downvoting this are cordially encouraged to have a look at countries that have no taxes. No one is thinking there should be no taxation, just that the

> People downvoting this are cordially encouraged to have a look at countries that have no taxes. No one is thinking there should be no taxation, just that there's a sizable chance here that the government is in the wrong. To reverse your argument: please point me to this magical utopia where the government is always right and they never abuse their powers.

jacquesm 9y ago
Switzerland is doing pretty good. It is the only country where I know the citizens say we have decided instead of the government has decided. Oh, and they do pay taxes.
- astrodust 9y ago
  Switzerland is not a model for how to run a typical country.
  - kromem 9y ago
    I never understand how people point to existing systems that are working for a country, and then make the (valid) point that the success of those policies can't necessarily be extrapolated to another country, but then (invalidly) believe that is a suficient statement to end the conversation. Especially because those people often are talking about countries with some form of democratic socialism (where there are a number of strong success cases), and instead frequently put forward libertarianism - which is a completely untested government form in any country.
    - kevin_thibedeau 9y ago
      Switzerland sustains itself with a huge influx of foreign money by adopting policies attractive to the wealthy. That strategy can't be pursued by every nation on the planet.
      - whoishiring_ch 9y ago
        It is both attractive to the wealthy and the poor. Waiters here make more after taxes than engineers in Germany.
      - s3nnyy 9y ago
        It's also good for the poor. Waiters in Switezrland make more after taxes than engineers in Germany. That is one of the reaons I moved here. Here more about this: "8 reasons why I moved to Switzerland to work in tech" https://medium.com/@iwaninzurich/eight-reasons-why-i-moved-to-switzerland-to-work-in-it-c7ac18af4f90 https://medium.com/@iwaninzurich/eight-reasons-why-i-moved-t...
  - icantdrive55 9y ago
    Why not? If I was looking for a place to live, it would be high on my list. I love they are tying fees/fines to income level too. Something, l feel, that the US should give a shot?
rjzzleep 9y ago
edited the structure Your inverse isn't correct. The correct inverse would be to look at the countries that do have tax. Let's look at Guinea There's the tax information: http://www.doingbusiness.org/data/exploreeconomies/guinea/paying-taxes http://www.doingbusiness.org/data/exploreeconomies/guinea/pa... Oh by the way it's the poorest country in the world 2017. I did take a look at what jacquesm suggested and here is a list of countries that have no income tax. * United Arab Emirates * Oman * Bahrain * Qatar * Saudi Arabia * Kuwait * Bermuda * Cayman Islands * The Bahamas * Brunei Now you could argue that the countries are rich countries and the only ones doing well are the native citizens or that two of them are tax havens for the rich. But hey that's not what he said. And the moral of the story? Unquantified generic statements are usually bad. Don't do it. No matter who you are, don't do it.
- astrodust 9y ago
  They're subsisting on taxes, just not income taxes. Half of those are living off of royalties on oil, the others from investment banking.
- strictnein 9y ago
  You understand that I wasn't taking issue with the taxation point, right? Just that there is a possibility that this is a case of egregious government abuse of power, not a case of dodging taxes, therefore utilizing an argument based on the idea of no taxation was missing the point. He also said "no taxes", not "no income taxes".
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]

jacquesm 9y ago

Switzerland is doing pretty good. It is the only country where I know the citizens say we have decided instead of the government has decided. Oh, and they do pay taxes.

astrodust 9y ago
Switzerland is not a model for how to run a typical country.
- kromem 9y ago
  I never understand how people point to existing systems that are working for a country, and then make the (valid) point that the success of those policies can't necessarily be extrapolated to another country, but then (invalidly) believe that is a suficient statement to end the conversation. Especially because those people often are talking about countries with some form of democratic socialism (where there are a number of strong success cases), and instead frequently put forward libertarianism - which is a completely untested government form in any country.
  - kevin_thibedeau 9y ago
    Switzerland sustains itself with a huge influx of foreign money by adopting policies attractive to the wealthy. That strategy can't be pursued by every nation on the planet.
    - whoishiring_ch 9y ago
      It is both attractive to the wealthy and the poor. Waiters here make more after taxes than engineers in Germany.
    - s3nnyy 9y ago
      It's also good for the poor. Waiters in Switezrland make more after taxes than engineers in Germany. That is one of the reaons I moved here. Here more about this: "8 reasons why I moved to Switzerland to work in tech" https://medium.com/@iwaninzurich/eight-reasons-why-i-moved-to-switzerland-to-work-in-it-c7ac18af4f90 https://medium.com/@iwaninzurich/eight-reasons-why-i-moved-t...
- icantdrive55 9y ago
  Why not? If I was looking for a place to live, it would be high on my list. I love they are tying fees/fines to income level too. Something, l feel, that the US should give a shot?

rjzzleep 9y ago

edited the structure Your inverse isn't correct. The correct inverse would be to look at the countries that do have tax. Let's look at Guinea There's the tax information: http://www.doingbusiness.org/data/exploreeconomies/guinea/paying-taxes http://www.doingbusiness.org/data/exploreeconomies/guinea/pa... Oh by the way it's the poorest country in the world 2017. I did take a look at what jacquesm suggested and here is a list of countries that have no income tax. * United Arab Emirates * Oman * Bahrain * Qatar * Saudi Arabia * Kuwait * Bermuda * Cayman Islands * The Bahamas * Brunei Now you could argue that the countries are rich countries and the only ones doing well are the native citizens or that two of them are tax havens for the rich. But hey that's not what he said. And the moral of the story? Unquantified generic statements are usually bad. Don't do it. No matter who you are, don't do it.

astrodust 9y ago
They're subsisting on taxes, just not income taxes. Half of those are living off of royalties on oil, the others from investment banking.
strictnein 9y ago
You understand that I wasn't taking issue with the taxation point, right? Just that there is a possibility that this is a case of egregious government abuse of power, not a case of dodging taxes, therefore utilizing an argument based on the idea of no taxation was missing the point. He also said "no taxes", not "no income taxes".
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]