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> I was once convinced that China was on the verge of becoming a new force in modern technology They have amazingly intelligent people and a wonderful hacker c

by donatj 9y ago

> I was once convinced that China was on the verge of becoming a new force in modern technology They have amazingly intelligent people and a wonderful hacker community, the problem is it stands entirely at odds with the government's "what's best for society" attitude. The problem most overtly controlling government's aren't willing to accept is that what's best for society this exact moment might not be what's best for it overall. This is why there's no Chinese technology leaders, no Chinese Apple. Communism brews mediocrity.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
darpa_escapee 9y ago
OTOH, Alibaba, wechat etc
- donatj 9y ago
  Have you actually used any of these? Alibaba is worse than Craigslist. Leaders they are not,
  - paradite 9y ago
    On top of my head: - Chat/Social Media: Wechat's P2P money transfer, cashless transaction - Drone: DJI - Phone: Xiaomi Mi Mix, One Plus series - JS framework: Vue.js
    - gruez 9y ago
      > Chat/Social Media: Wechat's P2P money transfer, cashless transaction helps when there are no foreign competitors (thanks, GFW!), and credit/debit card infrastructure is underdeveloped > Phone: Xiaomi Mi Mix, One Plus series Both of which are barely profitable or operating at a loss >JS framework: Vue.js MVVC with html bindings has been around for years now
      - paradite 9y ago
        So I'm just wondering if your measurement of success/leader is based on innovation, profitability, or popularity? Because you seem to be picking the whatever that suit your argument, while we usually consider any one of them to be an achievement.
        gruez 9y ago
        I think you were ultimately referencing this line >This is why there's no Chinese technology leaders, no Chinese Apple Going off that, > Chat/Social Media: Wechat's P2P money transfer, cashless transaction same point as in my original comment, and it shows because there's barely any use outside of china (and maybe expat communities). they're only a "leader" in china. > Phone: Xiaomi Mi Mix, One Plus series For one, apple has killer margins on its phones, whereas they do not. Even comparing among android phone manufacturers, they're worse in terms of market share and profitability (as opposed to Samsung, for instance). Their only selling point their $/performance, which will surely disappear when their VC subsidy runs out. "leaders" aren't underdogs. "leaders" don't sell discounted phones at a loss. >JS framework: Vue.js I can't say i know the js ecosystem very well, but vue.js does seem to be the fastest growing MVVC framework (at least in the realm of logic-in-tags languages). But the problem I see is that javascript frameworks come and go, and it could very well drop off a cliff in a year or two after the next hottest thing comes out. Is it a leader? Sure, for now...
  - rkido 9y ago
    Try using WeChat every day for a few months and then tell me again they're not leading the pack. I don't even use it in China (where it's power is significantly higher than everywhere else), yet even ignoring features that only work in China, it is by far the most powerful messaging client currently available.
    - riskable 9y ago
      Define, "powerful" because WeChat is the only chat application I know if that has built-in government censorship. That sounds like the opposite of "powerful" to me. "Enjoy chatting with your friends while the government of China monitors your every character and transaction!" ...unless you meant "powerful censorship and dissent-destroying spy capabilities."
  - voltagex_ 9y ago
    Alibaba or Aliexpress? I've got tens of packages off Aliexpress and have had no problems other than slow delivery (although it seems to be improving). Yes, you have to know what you're looking for and you'll occasionally run across very low quality products (motorcycle gloves), but you'll find the same on eBay - where do you think most of those sellers are buying from?
1_2__4 9y ago
You act as if the Chinese populace doesn't broadly suppprt their government, including these kinds of restrictions.
- sgift 9y ago
  It's hard to know if they do - everyone who dares to state something else finds themselves in dire circumstances.
- yorwba 9y ago
  I'd say those who aren't affected don't care much. The rest tries to find ways around it. Every student I met during an exchange semester in Shanghai was using a VPN to access foreign websites.
rkido 9y ago
Um, you seem to be unaware of Tencent and Alibaba, both vast enterprises. Tencent owns League of Legends, the biggest multiplayer game in the world, as well as WeChat, which is comparable to WhatsApp in number of users. WeChat is revered by tech leaders in the West, it basically blows everything else out of the water in terms of features and robustness.
- tyrell_corp 9y ago
  Tencent did not create League of Legends. They just bought the company that did, Riot Games(American).

by donatj 9y ago

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

darpa_escapee 9y ago

OTOH, Alibaba, wechat etc

donatj 9y ago
Have you actually used any of these? Alibaba is worse than Craigslist. Leaders they are not,
- paradite 9y ago
  On top of my head: - Chat/Social Media: Wechat's P2P money transfer, cashless transaction - Drone: DJI - Phone: Xiaomi Mi Mix, One Plus series - JS framework: Vue.js
  - gruez 9y ago
    > Chat/Social Media: Wechat's P2P money transfer, cashless transaction helps when there are no foreign competitors (thanks, GFW!), and credit/debit card infrastructure is underdeveloped > Phone: Xiaomi Mi Mix, One Plus series Both of which are barely profitable or operating at a loss >JS framework: Vue.js MVVC with html bindings has been around for years now
    - paradite 9y ago
      So I'm just wondering if your measurement of success/leader is based on innovation, profitability, or popularity? Because you seem to be picking the whatever that suit your argument, while we usually consider any one of them to be an achievement.
      - gruez 9y ago
        I think you were ultimately referencing this line >This is why there's no Chinese technology leaders, no Chinese Apple Going off that, > Chat/Social Media: Wechat's P2P money transfer, cashless transaction same point as in my original comment, and it shows because there's barely any use outside of china (and maybe expat communities). they're only a "leader" in china. > Phone: Xiaomi Mi Mix, One Plus series For one, apple has killer margins on its phones, whereas they do not. Even comparing among android phone manufacturers, they're worse in terms of market share and profitability (as opposed to Samsung, for instance). Their only selling point their $/performance, which will surely disappear when their VC subsidy runs out. "leaders" aren't underdogs. "leaders" don't sell discounted phones at a loss. >JS framework: Vue.js I can't say i know the js ecosystem very well, but vue.js does seem to be the fastest growing MVVC framework (at least in the realm of logic-in-tags languages). But the problem I see is that javascript frameworks come and go, and it could very well drop off a cliff in a year or two after the next hottest thing comes out. Is it a leader? Sure, for now...
- rkido 9y ago
  Try using WeChat every day for a few months and then tell me again they're not leading the pack. I don't even use it in China (where it's power is significantly higher than everywhere else), yet even ignoring features that only work in China, it is by far the most powerful messaging client currently available.
  - riskable 9y ago
    Define, "powerful" because WeChat is the only chat application I know if that has built-in government censorship. That sounds like the opposite of "powerful" to me. "Enjoy chatting with your friends while the government of China monitors your every character and transaction!" ...unless you meant "powerful censorship and dissent-destroying spy capabilities."
- voltagex_ 9y ago
  Alibaba or Aliexpress? I've got tens of packages off Aliexpress and have had no problems other than slow delivery (although it seems to be improving). Yes, you have to know what you're looking for and you'll occasionally run across very low quality products (motorcycle gloves), but you'll find the same on eBay - where do you think most of those sellers are buying from?

1_2__4 9y ago

You act as if the Chinese populace doesn't broadly suppprt their government, including these kinds of restrictions.

sgift 9y ago
It's hard to know if they do - everyone who dares to state something else finds themselves in dire circumstances.
yorwba 9y ago
I'd say those who aren't affected don't care much. The rest tries to find ways around it. Every student I met during an exchange semester in Shanghai was using a VPN to access foreign websites.

rkido 9y ago

Um, you seem to be unaware of Tencent and Alibaba, both vast enterprises. Tencent owns League of Legends, the biggest multiplayer game in the world, as well as WeChat, which is comparable to WhatsApp in number of users. WeChat is revered by tech leaders in the West, it basically blows everything else out of the water in terms of features and robustness.

tyrell_corp 9y ago
Tencent did not create League of Legends. They just bought the company that did, Riot Games(American).