4 ms·

Most men in the US and Europe could be infertile by 2060

meric 9y ago
Sperm count is correlated with testosterone levels, and testosterone levels have also been dropping. http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/18/modern-life-rough-on-men http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/18/modern-life-rough-o...
EmilStenstrom 9y ago
I never thought The Handmaid's Tale was a documentary about the actual, real future ahead of us...
c3534l 9y ago
If you take any trend in any direction and extrapolate it linearly, you will always wind up with an absurd number. I lost two pounds this week. At this rate I'll be dead in a year or two and weigh negative 50 pounds on the third.
- Clubber 9y ago
  I wish I could say I lost two pounds this week. I probably gained. I will be the size of the known universe eventually.
  - siberianbear 9y ago
    I assure that this is not your fate. Eventually you'd become so large that you collapse into a black hole, and then you'd slowly evaporate due to Hawking Radiation. Nature has a feedback mechanism for everything.
    - ithkuil 9y ago
      Provided that your density is low enough you don't necessary become a black hole by just gaining weight.
    - Fjolsvith 9y ago
      Would one go supernova on the way to the black hole?
- tchow 9y ago
  They took a trend of 40 years. You took a trend of 1 week.
  - ramblerman 9y ago
    Doesn't matter to the point he is making. > I grew 182cm in the first 40 years of my life, By that rate I will be more than 3.5m tall in my eighties.
- glandium 9y ago
  Speaking of absurd extrapolations, at the current population growth rate, the human race will have used all the particules in the universe in only 8604 years. https://youtu.be/lpj0E0a0mlU https://youtu.be/lpj0E0a0mlU
- openmosix 9y ago
  Relevant xkcd https://xkcd.com/605/ https://xkcd.com/605/
snissn 9y ago
Is there justification to continue the extrapolation?
s3nnyy 9y ago
> found no decline in sperm counts in men from Asia, Africa and South America ... US/European men will have little or no reproductive capacity ... Still, this is alarming that we don't know why this happens.
- fwdslash 9y ago
  More low-level radiation access? (smartphones/computers/smartwatches) More refined sugar? Less physical activity? I really wonder what it could be, though.
  - michaelmrose 9y ago
    Computers and phones don't provide any radiation of the variety you are thinking of. It's not merely a matter of degree it's a difference in category. For more info look up ionizing radiation.
    - MichailP 9y ago
      Are you suggesting that microwave oven doesn't work because it doesn't use ionizing radiation? Nonionizing radiation CAN have effects on humans, and current regulations are only based on temperature effects i.e a proxy like a SAR value. But there can be many effects of nonionizing radiation even before it raises tissue temperature level.
      - eesmith 9y ago
        I believe michaelmrose is suggesting that while microwaves are indeed a form of (electromagnetic) radiation, "low-level radiation" usually refers to low-levels of ionizing radiation, not low-power EM sources. While fwdslash might indeed be talking about low-level microwaves, there are many in my experience who think that "radiation" only means "ionizing radiation" or "atomic radiation". (Hence, "nuke it in the microwave".) Again, in my experience, people who are aware of the distinction tend to write "More low-power microwaves" than "More low-level radiation". For a semblance of hard numbers, "low-level radiation" gives 735 hits in PubMed Central (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiatio... ) and 338 in PubMed (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radia... ). '"low-level radiation" microwave" gives 32 (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22+microwave https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiatio... ) and 2 (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22+microwave https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radia... ), respectively. One of the latter is https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17886009 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17886009 where you can see "low-level radiation" is used to describe microwaves: "On the radar station area, blue tits nested in high exposed nest-boxes (67,0%) and great tit occupied mainly these boxes, which were exposed to low-level radiation", where that radiation is "pulse-modulated microwave radiation of 1,200-3,000 MHz." It's just not common. The topic, by the way, concerns sperm counts. You write "there can be many effects". Is a change in sperm count one of them? Many people have done experiments on the effect of microwaves from mobile phones on organisms. I was at a biology conference about 25 years ago where one of the speakers talked about their research, so surely this has been tested already. Also, radio and TV techs have been working with high-power EM for decades. There's so much power in the air around some towers that florescent tubes can glow. If low-power microwaves have an effect on fertility then we should have seen an effect on those workers long ago, yes?
rebuilder 9y ago
Taking a trend with an unknown cause and extrapolating seems unlikely to yield accurate predictions. The actual news here is that in USA and Europe, male sperm counts have fallen 50-60% between 1973 and 2011. That's alarming enough on its own without sensational headlines like this.
Axsuul 9y ago
If it is indeed due to our increasingly toxic environment, then we should perform studies based on different diets and the types of foods each group consumes. My hypothesis is that our food sources are huge culprits here.
basicplus2 9y ago
Glysophate causes sperm count drop and cancer http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/03/pesticides-result-in-lower-sperm-counts/ http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/03/pesticides-res...
- s3nnyy 9y ago
  Might help to wash veggies with Natron (baking soda) before eating to remove at least the pesticides on the surface of the food? https://happyherbivore.com/2012/12/how-to-wash-veggies-baking-soda-vinegar/ https://happyherbivore.com/2012/12/how-to-wash-veggies-bakin...
oaeu23tnoe0 9y ago
This is a load of crap. >if the data on sperm counts is extrapolated to its logical conclusion, men will have little or no reproductive capacity from 2060 onwards. No, that's not extrapolating to its logical conclusion. That's extrapolating a trend as if it will continue without changing. In reality, even at these lower levels, sperm counts are considered in the normal range.
hbcondo714 9y ago
Just like the movie Children of Men https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_of_Men https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_of_Men
nigrioid 9y ago
Quite a mix of propaganda & fear on that website. It's a trend I'm noticing more and more lately.
- conanbatt 9y ago
  If the trends continue, the fear propagated by website will be so absolute everyone will kill themselves immediately.
clumsysmurf 9y ago
"Even in adults, exposure to chemicals, such as bisphenol A, which are thought to affect fertility, can have a negative effect" BPA is very common in paper receipts you get when buying stuff from the store. A study in JAMA showed that for people who handle receipts often, it is detectable in urine: http://www.newsweek.com/youre-absorbing-bpa-your-receipts-study-shows-230178 http://www.newsweek.com/youre-absorbing-bpa-your-receipts-st...

Sperm count is correlated with testosterone levels, and testosterone levels have also been dropping. http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/18/modern-life-rough-on-men http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/18/modern-life-rough-o...

EmilStenstrom 9y ago

I never thought The Handmaid's Tale was a documentary about the actual, real future ahead of us...

c3534l 9y ago

If you take any trend in any direction and extrapolate it linearly, you will always wind up with an absurd number. I lost two pounds this week. At this rate I'll be dead in a year or two and weigh negative 50 pounds on the third.

Clubber 9y ago
I wish I could say I lost two pounds this week. I probably gained. I will be the size of the known universe eventually.
- siberianbear 9y ago
  I assure that this is not your fate. Eventually you'd become so large that you collapse into a black hole, and then you'd slowly evaporate due to Hawking Radiation. Nature has a feedback mechanism for everything.
  - ithkuil 9y ago
    Provided that your density is low enough you don't necessary become a black hole by just gaining weight.
  - Fjolsvith 9y ago
    Would one go supernova on the way to the black hole?
tchow 9y ago
They took a trend of 40 years. You took a trend of 1 week.
- ramblerman 9y ago
  Doesn't matter to the point he is making. > I grew 182cm in the first 40 years of my life, By that rate I will be more than 3.5m tall in my eighties.
glandium 9y ago
Speaking of absurd extrapolations, at the current population growth rate, the human race will have used all the particules in the universe in only 8604 years. https://youtu.be/lpj0E0a0mlU https://youtu.be/lpj0E0a0mlU
openmosix 9y ago
Relevant xkcd https://xkcd.com/605/ https://xkcd.com/605/

snissn 9y ago

Is there justification to continue the extrapolation?

s3nnyy 9y ago

> found no decline in sperm counts in men from Asia, Africa and South America ... US/European men will have little or no reproductive capacity ... Still, this is alarming that we don't know why this happens.

fwdslash 9y ago
More low-level radiation access? (smartphones/computers/smartwatches) More refined sugar? Less physical activity? I really wonder what it could be, though.
- michaelmrose 9y ago
  Computers and phones don't provide any radiation of the variety you are thinking of. It's not merely a matter of degree it's a difference in category. For more info look up ionizing radiation.
  - MichailP 9y ago
    Are you suggesting that microwave oven doesn't work because it doesn't use ionizing radiation? Nonionizing radiation CAN have effects on humans, and current regulations are only based on temperature effects i.e a proxy like a SAR value. But there can be many effects of nonionizing radiation even before it raises tissue temperature level.
    - eesmith 9y ago
      I believe michaelmrose is suggesting that while microwaves are indeed a form of (electromagnetic) radiation, "low-level radiation" usually refers to low-levels of ionizing radiation, not low-power EM sources. While fwdslash might indeed be talking about low-level microwaves, there are many in my experience who think that "radiation" only means "ionizing radiation" or "atomic radiation". (Hence, "nuke it in the microwave".) Again, in my experience, people who are aware of the distinction tend to write "More low-power microwaves" than "More low-level radiation". For a semblance of hard numbers, "low-level radiation" gives 735 hits in PubMed Central (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiatio... ) and 338 in PubMed (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radia... ). '"low-level radiation" microwave" gives 32 (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22+microwave https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=%22low-level+radiatio... ) and 2 (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radiation%22+microwave https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22low-level+radia... ), respectively. One of the latter is https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17886009 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17886009 where you can see "low-level radiation" is used to describe microwaves: "On the radar station area, blue tits nested in high exposed nest-boxes (67,0%) and great tit occupied mainly these boxes, which were exposed to low-level radiation", where that radiation is "pulse-modulated microwave radiation of 1,200-3,000 MHz." It's just not common. The topic, by the way, concerns sperm counts. You write "there can be many effects". Is a change in sperm count one of them? Many people have done experiments on the effect of microwaves from mobile phones on organisms. I was at a biology conference about 25 years ago where one of the speakers talked about their research, so surely this has been tested already. Also, radio and TV techs have been working with high-power EM for decades. There's so much power in the air around some towers that florescent tubes can glow. If low-power microwaves have an effect on fertility then we should have seen an effect on those workers long ago, yes?

rebuilder 9y ago

Taking a trend with an unknown cause and extrapolating seems unlikely to yield accurate predictions. The actual news here is that in USA and Europe, male sperm counts have fallen 50-60% between 1973 and 2011. That's alarming enough on its own without sensational headlines like this.

Axsuul 9y ago

If it is indeed due to our increasingly toxic environment, then we should perform studies based on different diets and the types of foods each group consumes. My hypothesis is that our food sources are huge culprits here.

basicplus2 9y ago

Glysophate causes sperm count drop and cancer http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/03/pesticides-result-in-lower-sperm-counts/ http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2015/03/pesticides-res...

s3nnyy 9y ago
Might help to wash veggies with Natron (baking soda) before eating to remove at least the pesticides on the surface of the food? https://happyherbivore.com/2012/12/how-to-wash-veggies-baking-soda-vinegar/ https://happyherbivore.com/2012/12/how-to-wash-veggies-bakin...

oaeu23tnoe0 9y ago

This is a load of crap. >if the data on sperm counts is extrapolated to its logical conclusion, men will have little or no reproductive capacity from 2060 onwards. No, that's not extrapolating to its logical conclusion. That's extrapolating a trend as if it will continue without changing. In reality, even at these lower levels, sperm counts are considered in the normal range.

hbcondo714 9y ago

Just like the movie Children of Men https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_of_Men https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_of_Men

nigrioid 9y ago

Quite a mix of propaganda & fear on that website. It's a trend I'm noticing more and more lately.

conanbatt 9y ago
If the trends continue, the fear propagated by website will be so absolute everyone will kill themselves immediately.

clumsysmurf 9y ago

"Even in adults, exposure to chemicals, such as bisphenol A, which are thought to affect fertility, can have a negative effect" BPA is very common in paper receipts you get when buying stuff from the store. A study in JAMA showed that for people who handle receipts often, it is detectable in urine: http://www.newsweek.com/youre-absorbing-bpa-your-receipts-study-shows-230178 http://www.newsweek.com/youre-absorbing-bpa-your-receipts-st...