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> the integrated IDE/program experience, which Ruby, Python, Elixir do not give. True, but be aware that Java IDE's give you ten times more features and refact
by hota_mazi 9y ago
> the integrated IDE/program experience, which Ruby, Python, Elixir do not give.
True, but be aware that Java IDE's give you ten times more features and refactorings than Smalltalk IDE's can ever give you, because of the simple fact that Smalltalk is dynamically typed (which means it's pretty much impossible for them to provide automated refactorings: most of these need to be supervised by a human).
- pjmlp 9y agoRefactoring tools appeared for the first time on Smalltalk. Eclipse was reborn from Visual Age for Smalltalk.
- hota_mazi 9y agoI am aware, my point still stands: the refactorings available in Java IDE's are more powerful, safer and more numerous than the Smalltalk IDE ever offered. Which shouldn't come as a surprise since Smalltalk is dynamically typed, which means automated refactorings are impossible to achieve without human supervision.
- coldtea 9y agoA Smalltalk image/IDE being dynamically typed doesn't mean anything, as it can have a full live-above-AST-level knowledge of everything in the program -- including the dynamic types of everything. Think of it as ten times the power of Java's reflection. What you can do in such a system (without human intervention) makes IntelliJ/Eclipse look like Pico.
- hota_mazi 9y agoI think you have no idea what the Smalltalk refactoring browser is actually capable of doing (and not doing). Please read this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15113804 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15113804