7 ms·

Headphone startup Kanoa shuts down

47 points by sswaner 9y ago

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
smaili 9y ago
Slightly off topic but why would their farewell announcement be routed to /password?
- jedberg 9y ago
  Most likely their website was designed to redirect anyone who isn't logged in to their login page, but then they configured the web server to just server the farewell notice no matter what page you are looking at. If you put any URL in, it redirects to /password.
  - justboxing 9y ago
    > If you put any URL in, it redirects to /password. Wow, you are right. https://getkanoa.com/wescrewedupbigtime https://getkanoa.com/wescrewedupbigtime
CaliforniaKarl 9y ago
So, I work in the Valley, and I read & participate here, but I'm not working at a startup, and most of it is unknown to me. With that note, I have a question! >Most significantly and to our unpleasant surprise, our investors recently backed out of our funding round. I don't understand something about this. I mean, yes, it is very un-specific, but I am wondering, when is the 'point of no return' for something like this? Is it possible for a VC firm to go through all the motions, and say all the right things, and then back out 10 seconds before wiring payment for whatever reason they want? Of course, I don't know if that happened here. It just seems to me like stories regularly appear of a VC backing out at the last minute.
- dogma1138 9y ago
  Yes, as long as money haven't changed hands you can pull out usually at any time. Furthermore funding is often not a one time payment but is paid in installments with preset milestones which means that the investor can still pull out at any time. For the most part the investors hold all the cards, sure you can potentially draft a contract that would lock investors but no one would commit to those terms.
- jeeyoungk 9y ago
  Point of no return is when the VCs wire money to you. These people tend to exaggerate their funding prospective, saying things like "they backed out". Ultimately VCs don't owe anybody money and startups are not entitled with funding. Investing is just like any other purchase, and as a VC if you believe that a company is not worthwhile to invest then you should be ready to say no no matter what stage the conversation is in. Ironically the fact that the company couldn't raise another round / continue without finding is a sign that VCs did make a right choice.
  - flukus 9y ago
    > Point of no return is when the VCs wire money to you. I'd be surprised if there wasn't some sort of cool off period in the contracts.
    - therein 9y ago
      If that was the case, VCs would wait until they would have wired the money to you before they signed the contracts.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
- pfarnsworth 9y ago
  VCs are notorious for blowing smoke up your ass and then pulling funding at the very last second. Things like that happen all the time, it's not actually a surprise.
SyneRyder 9y ago
Hmm. There was an excellent comment here that has vanished. It added that there's been bad reviews of the product in the last week, and more importantly, a claim that the startup offered bribes of $500 for good reviews. Bad reviews are one thing, but I can see if there's even accusations of corruption, that might cause investors to back off at least until it can be cleared up. The video review link is here - I've updated the timestamp directly to the bribe claim. Worth noting that the video title seems to have been updated in the last 24 hours too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM&t=24m40s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM&t=24m40s
- kozak 9y ago
  They use careful wording: "good review" might be interpreted as "a detailed and objective review", not necessarily one that praises the product.
  - SyneRyder 9y ago
    Yep, I noticed that too. All the same, offering to pay for a review, especially for completing it before a specific deadline, seems rather dodgy. At a minimum it would require reviewers to disclose that they had received compensation for the review.
stryk 9y ago
It's worth mentioning that a reviewer on YouTube recently posted a scathing review of their product[1]. It's a long video so TL;DR: product is junk and they knew it plus they tried to pay him off with a paltry $500. No idea how much of am impact this made on the decision to shutter the company. 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM
- dannylandau 9y ago
  That was an amazing review. Very harsh! But interesting to see how companies reach out to get publicity.
- sclangdon 9y ago
  I particularly liked the part where he tells the engineer "you're not understanding me, I don't care why it doesn't work, I'm just telling you that it doesn't work. I'm a consumer and these are $300 earphones and they can't send a signal from my ears to my ass" [1] Reminds me of so many people I've worked with who think it matters to consumers/users why something doesn't work. Like they can justify it, and it's not that big a deal. 1. https://youtu.be/36Gw3tErUSM?t=16m20s https://youtu.be/36Gw3tErUSM?t=16m20s
  - dragonwriter 9y ago
    > I'm a consumer and these are $300 earphones and they can't send a signal from my ears to my ass To be fair, that's not the intended function of earphones.
    - joncrocks 9y ago
      From the video, they're wireless headphones, connected to his phone and his phone was in one of his back pockets and couldn't stay connected for more than '10-12 seconds'.
      - DiThi 9y ago
        I think he means the signal is supposed to go the opposite direction. Just a funny mistake.
dovdovdov 9y ago
Great, now I'll have to settle with a major company's properly developed product that comes with continuous product and customer support. :/
nartz 9y ago
"Our founder invested the initial capital in KANOA, which went primarily into market research and a feasibility study designed by a large engineering firm hired to develop the product." Founder immediately outsourced basic research and development - suspect at best. Working with an established engineering firm may be a good choice at some point, but my guess is that costs were 10x what they should have been, especially in the early stages where the product was going through iterations, bug fixes, etc.
pfarnsworth 9y ago
I don't see how Kickstarter or Indiegogo have much a future when many high-profile campaigns fail so spectacularly. The CEO of both those companies must know that "buyer beware" doesn't cut it and their namebrands are being tarnished by letting backers be swindled like this. They need a way to protect backers from complete losses of money, by delivering money in tranches after hitting milestones, or doing a complete demo in real life at the headquarters, once it reaches a certain level of funding.
noyesno 9y ago
Can anyone recommend good wireless earbuds that isolate outside noise?
- 112233 9y ago
  try and look at sonies, like mdr-ex31. their ANC is quite subtle
- tmikaeld 9y ago
  These seem to be the best on the market (Considering the amount of pre-reviews from the kickstarter). https://www.revols.com/ https://www.revols.com/ But they haven't yet launched to backers so, It's a risk.
  - mdekkers 9y ago
    These seem to be the best on the market[...]But they haven't yet launched How can they be "the best on the market" without having launched?
    - tmikaeld 9y ago
      Seem to be, as per reviews. Since there is only 5 others with ear shaping tips but with bad reviews...
- nunez 9y ago
  If you don't mind sub-par call quality, the Bragi "The Headphone" headphones (yeah...) are absolutely incredible and are a worthy alternative to Apple AirPods while providing passive noise isolation. Great range, good sound quality (not as much bass as the AirPods), super duper comfortable, and looks amazing in your ears. The Dash Pro is the more advanced version of these headphones but reviews are mixed and $350 is a lot of money to gamble on headphones (for most of us). By "sub-par", I mean "people can hear you, mostly, until they start talking or you step outside/out of range." If that wasn't a problem, I'd still be wearing mine. Absolutely loved the product.
gadders 9y ago
This is one of those annoying webpages that dims the whole screen. Windows 10 and Chrome Version 60.0.3112.101. I don't think it's the webpage's fault, but something on pages like it is triggering it. Anyone know what the fix is? //edit// Firefox 54.0.1 (32-bit) as well.
- tallanvor 9y ago
  Windows 10 and the same version of Firefox as you, and nothing gets dimmed on my screen.
- ctz 9y ago
  Some screens have dynamic brightness/contrast adjustment which can cause this effect.
  - ucho 9y ago
    Some monitors just have bad backlight. I had old one where maximizing terminal(which is mostly black) window caused taskbar and window handle also to turn almost black.
- therein 9y ago
  Are you sure it isn't some auto-adjustment on your monitor? Tried on Arch and Windows with Chrome and Firefox and no dimming.
Allower 9y ago
Basically trying to save face after making inexcusable and amateur mistakes. They should just fess up and say, hey we suck at fucking everything, but we wanted to take your money anyway, now we cant even do that. boo hoo.

47 points by sswaner 9y ago

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

smaili 9y ago

Slightly off topic but why would their farewell announcement be routed to /password?

jedberg 9y ago
Most likely their website was designed to redirect anyone who isn't logged in to their login page, but then they configured the web server to just server the farewell notice no matter what page you are looking at. If you put any URL in, it redirects to /password.
- justboxing 9y ago
  > If you put any URL in, it redirects to /password. Wow, you are right. https://getkanoa.com/wescrewedupbigtime https://getkanoa.com/wescrewedupbigtime

CaliforniaKarl 9y ago

So, I work in the Valley, and I read & participate here, but I'm not working at a startup, and most of it is unknown to me. With that note, I have a question! >Most significantly and to our unpleasant surprise, our investors recently backed out of our funding round. I don't understand something about this. I mean, yes, it is very un-specific, but I am wondering, when is the 'point of no return' for something like this? Is it possible for a VC firm to go through all the motions, and say all the right things, and then back out 10 seconds before wiring payment for whatever reason they want? Of course, I don't know if that happened here. It just seems to me like stories regularly appear of a VC backing out at the last minute.

dogma1138 9y ago
Yes, as long as money haven't changed hands you can pull out usually at any time. Furthermore funding is often not a one time payment but is paid in installments with preset milestones which means that the investor can still pull out at any time. For the most part the investors hold all the cards, sure you can potentially draft a contract that would lock investors but no one would commit to those terms.
jeeyoungk 9y ago
Point of no return is when the VCs wire money to you. These people tend to exaggerate their funding prospective, saying things like "they backed out". Ultimately VCs don't owe anybody money and startups are not entitled with funding. Investing is just like any other purchase, and as a VC if you believe that a company is not worthwhile to invest then you should be ready to say no no matter what stage the conversation is in. Ironically the fact that the company couldn't raise another round / continue without finding is a sign that VCs did make a right choice.
- flukus 9y ago
  > Point of no return is when the VCs wire money to you. I'd be surprised if there wasn't some sort of cool off period in the contracts.
  - therein 9y ago
    If that was the case, VCs would wait until they would have wired the money to you before they signed the contracts.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
pfarnsworth 9y ago
VCs are notorious for blowing smoke up your ass and then pulling funding at the very last second. Things like that happen all the time, it's not actually a surprise.

SyneRyder 9y ago

Hmm. There was an excellent comment here that has vanished. It added that there's been bad reviews of the product in the last week, and more importantly, a claim that the startup offered bribes of $500 for good reviews. Bad reviews are one thing, but I can see if there's even accusations of corruption, that might cause investors to back off at least until it can be cleared up. The video review link is here - I've updated the timestamp directly to the bribe claim. Worth noting that the video title seems to have been updated in the last 24 hours too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM&t=24m40s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM&t=24m40s

kozak 9y ago
They use careful wording: "good review" might be interpreted as "a detailed and objective review", not necessarily one that praises the product.
- SyneRyder 9y ago
  Yep, I noticed that too. All the same, offering to pay for a review, especially for completing it before a specific deadline, seems rather dodgy. At a minimum it would require reviewers to disclose that they had received compensation for the review.

stryk 9y ago

It's worth mentioning that a reviewer on YouTube recently posted a scathing review of their product[1]. It's a long video so TL;DR: product is junk and they knew it plus they tried to pay him off with a paltry $500. No idea how much of am impact this made on the decision to shutter the company. 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36Gw3tErUSM

dannylandau 9y ago
That was an amazing review. Very harsh! But interesting to see how companies reach out to get publicity.
sclangdon 9y ago
I particularly liked the part where he tells the engineer "you're not understanding me, I don't care why it doesn't work, I'm just telling you that it doesn't work. I'm a consumer and these are $300 earphones and they can't send a signal from my ears to my ass" [1] Reminds me of so many people I've worked with who think it matters to consumers/users why something doesn't work. Like they can justify it, and it's not that big a deal. 1. https://youtu.be/36Gw3tErUSM?t=16m20s https://youtu.be/36Gw3tErUSM?t=16m20s
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > I'm a consumer and these are $300 earphones and they can't send a signal from my ears to my ass To be fair, that's not the intended function of earphones.
  - joncrocks 9y ago
    From the video, they're wireless headphones, connected to his phone and his phone was in one of his back pockets and couldn't stay connected for more than '10-12 seconds'.
    - DiThi 9y ago
      I think he means the signal is supposed to go the opposite direction. Just a funny mistake.

dovdovdov 9y ago

Great, now I'll have to settle with a major company's properly developed product that comes with continuous product and customer support. :/

nartz 9y ago

"Our founder invested the initial capital in KANOA, which went primarily into market research and a feasibility study designed by a large engineering firm hired to develop the product." Founder immediately outsourced basic research and development - suspect at best. Working with an established engineering firm may be a good choice at some point, but my guess is that costs were 10x what they should have been, especially in the early stages where the product was going through iterations, bug fixes, etc.

pfarnsworth 9y ago

I don't see how Kickstarter or Indiegogo have much a future when many high-profile campaigns fail so spectacularly. The CEO of both those companies must know that "buyer beware" doesn't cut it and their namebrands are being tarnished by letting backers be swindled like this. They need a way to protect backers from complete losses of money, by delivering money in tranches after hitting milestones, or doing a complete demo in real life at the headquarters, once it reaches a certain level of funding.

noyesno 9y ago

Can anyone recommend good wireless earbuds that isolate outside noise?

112233 9y ago
try and look at sonies, like mdr-ex31. their ANC is quite subtle
tmikaeld 9y ago
These seem to be the best on the market (Considering the amount of pre-reviews from the kickstarter). https://www.revols.com/ https://www.revols.com/ But they haven't yet launched to backers so, It's a risk.
- mdekkers 9y ago
  These seem to be the best on the market[...]But they haven't yet launched How can they be "the best on the market" without having launched?
  - tmikaeld 9y ago
    Seem to be, as per reviews. Since there is only 5 others with ear shaping tips but with bad reviews...
nunez 9y ago
If you don't mind sub-par call quality, the Bragi "The Headphone" headphones (yeah...) are absolutely incredible and are a worthy alternative to Apple AirPods while providing passive noise isolation. Great range, good sound quality (not as much bass as the AirPods), super duper comfortable, and looks amazing in your ears. The Dash Pro is the more advanced version of these headphones but reviews are mixed and $350 is a lot of money to gamble on headphones (for most of us). By "sub-par", I mean "people can hear you, mostly, until they start talking or you step outside/out of range." If that wasn't a problem, I'd still be wearing mine. Absolutely loved the product.

gadders 9y ago

This is one of those annoying webpages that dims the whole screen. Windows 10 and Chrome Version 60.0.3112.101. I don't think it's the webpage's fault, but something on pages like it is triggering it. Anyone know what the fix is? //edit// Firefox 54.0.1 (32-bit) as well.

tallanvor 9y ago
Windows 10 and the same version of Firefox as you, and nothing gets dimmed on my screen.
ctz 9y ago
Some screens have dynamic brightness/contrast adjustment which can cause this effect.
- ucho 9y ago
  Some monitors just have bad backlight. I had old one where maximizing terminal(which is mostly black) window caused taskbar and window handle also to turn almost black.
therein 9y ago
Are you sure it isn't some auto-adjustment on your monitor? Tried on Arch and Windows with Chrome and Firefox and no dimming.

Allower 9y ago

Basically trying to save face after making inexcusable and amateur mistakes. They should just fess up and say, hey we suck at fucking everything, but we wanted to take your money anyway, now we cant even do that. boo hoo.