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CIA mind control program was (is?) real though

soundwave106 9y ago
One of the problems most conspiracy theories have is that they revolve around complex plotlines, that are executed in a flawless fashion. Very few things work out as neatly as a conspiracy theory in real life, and the CIA mind control attempts (eg MKUltra) is no execption. For all the awful details of that program, ironically one could argue that its most notable consequence was to help create 1960s counter-culture. (Without Project MKUltra, the life of Ken Kesey and Robert Hunter would have been very, very different.)
empath75 9y ago
Sure. But is it to blame for all of societies ills? The freemasons and George Soros, and jewish people, and the pope, and the FSB and most other targets of conspiracy theories are all certainly real. The question isn't whether criminal conspiracies or secret socieities or various other organizations and people exist, but whether they're all-powerful forces that drive history or not. What drives a conspiracy theorist is the idea that there is some simple explanation for everything that happens. An all-powerful 'enemy' that is the cause of all of the world's ills. I'm personally a believer, for example, that Putin ordered the FSB to interfere in the election last year and that it had some impact on the outcome. But I think what happened in the election last year was the confluence of a lot of unrelated trends, and wasn't the result of some grand scheme hatched in the Kremlin. Compare that to some of the wilder corners of the twitter-sphere where everything that happened from Snowden to Charlottesville was the result of some FSB operation. At some point it just strains credulity. On the other side, you have, of course the Trump-ist idea that the entire mass media is engaged in a misinformation campaign backed by the 'deep state' who is attempting the overthrow the president an institute a "globalist" new world order. I think both sides are operating under the assumption that there is some natural order and stability in American society, and it would just continue indefinitely and peacefully if it weren't for outsiders and people who are otherwise 'un-American" attacking it. The reality is that there are underlying tensions and instabilities that have been festering for decades (or even centuries) and they are becoming harder and harder to ignore for a variety of reasons. The current crisis in America is one of those things that 'just happened', and people are having a hard time coming to terms with the new reality they're living with and want to find someone to blame.
krapp 9y ago
The CIA attempted to study the possibility of mind control, but that doesn't make it reasonable to assume they ever could, or do, control people's minds. They also studied remote viewing and telepathy, but that doesn't mean the CIA has psychic spies.

One of the problems most conspiracy theories have is that they revolve around complex plotlines, that are executed in a flawless fashion. Very few things work out as neatly as a conspiracy theory in real life, and the CIA mind control attempts (eg MKUltra) is no execption. For all the awful details of that program, ironically one could argue that its most notable consequence was to help create 1960s counter-culture. (Without Project MKUltra, the life of Ken Kesey and Robert Hunter would have been very, very different.)

empath75 9y ago

Sure. But is it to blame for all of societies ills? The freemasons and George Soros, and jewish people, and the pope, and the FSB and most other targets of conspiracy theories are all certainly real. The question isn't whether criminal conspiracies or secret socieities or various other organizations and people exist, but whether they're all-powerful forces that drive history or not. What drives a conspiracy theorist is the idea that there is some simple explanation for everything that happens. An all-powerful 'enemy' that is the cause of all of the world's ills. I'm personally a believer, for example, that Putin ordered the FSB to interfere in the election last year and that it had some impact on the outcome. But I think what happened in the election last year was the confluence of a lot of unrelated trends, and wasn't the result of some grand scheme hatched in the Kremlin. Compare that to some of the wilder corners of the twitter-sphere where everything that happened from Snowden to Charlottesville was the result of some FSB operation. At some point it just strains credulity. On the other side, you have, of course the Trump-ist idea that the entire mass media is engaged in a misinformation campaign backed by the 'deep state' who is attempting the overthrow the president an institute a "globalist" new world order. I think both sides are operating under the assumption that there is some natural order and stability in American society, and it would just continue indefinitely and peacefully if it weren't for outsiders and people who are otherwise 'un-American" attacking it. The reality is that there are underlying tensions and instabilities that have been festering for decades (or even centuries) and they are becoming harder and harder to ignore for a variety of reasons. The current crisis in America is one of those things that 'just happened', and people are having a hard time coming to terms with the new reality they're living with and want to find someone to blame.

krapp 9y ago

The CIA attempted to study the possibility of mind control, but that doesn't make it reasonable to assume they ever could, or do, control people's minds. They also studied remote viewing and telepathy, but that doesn't mean the CIA has psychic spies.