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Financial compensation is only part of it. Most startups include longer hours and additional responsibilities that limit what else you can do with your life, s

Financial compensation is only part of it. Most startups include longer hours and additional responsibilities that limit what else you can do with your life, such as have a relationship, spend time with friends, or work on a side project. I'd guess you're at an established startup if you're only making ~$10k/year less than your last job in the defense industry. Pre-Series A startups are unlikely to pay even a third of what you'd make in that industry.

rdl 16y ago
A good eng in defense (at the level needed to be a startup founder) should be making 150 uncleared to 250 secret to 300 ts or project lead or more if deployable. Working 40 hour weeks (well, working 5 hour weeks with 35 hours of meetings, admin, paperwork, and overhead) A pre series a eng is making 30 to 60 if lucky. At series a, maybe 80 to 100. Defense is almost a perpetual job, whereas the half life of a pre series a startup is maybe 3 months, 1 yr for series a. (apologies for formatting, on iPad)
- gwc 16y ago
  A programmer working defense state-side does not make nearly those figures. 80 to 100 is much closer to what a software engineer with several years of experience makes working for a defense contractor than 250, though of course actual years of experience and how well one has played the corporate ladder game can make a big impact. Past a certain point it is relatively difficult to advance salary-wise without taking on management roles and giving up the hands-dirty side of programming / engineering. Once you're there it's an apples-to-oranges comparison for the kind of startups that are typical for HN-types ~ certainly no early stage startup is going to hire a 10-year manager to be employee #1 when what they really need is a hotshot programmer.
  - rdl 16y ago
    I admit my knowledge of stateside engineers in the large defense contractors is secondhand; trying to convert known deployed salaries and known eng and pm salaries at small product companies selling to usg. Substitute working for a fund on the dev side and double my numbers to make the original argument stronger.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]

rdl 16y ago

A good eng in defense (at the level needed to be a startup founder) should be making 150 uncleared to 250 secret to 300 ts or project lead or more if deployable. Working 40 hour weeks (well, working 5 hour weeks with 35 hours of meetings, admin, paperwork, and overhead) A pre series a eng is making 30 to 60 if lucky. At series a, maybe 80 to 100. Defense is almost a perpetual job, whereas the half life of a pre series a startup is maybe 3 months, 1 yr for series a. (apologies for formatting, on iPad)

gwc 16y ago
A programmer working defense state-side does not make nearly those figures. 80 to 100 is much closer to what a software engineer with several years of experience makes working for a defense contractor than 250, though of course actual years of experience and how well one has played the corporate ladder game can make a big impact. Past a certain point it is relatively difficult to advance salary-wise without taking on management roles and giving up the hands-dirty side of programming / engineering. Once you're there it's an apples-to-oranges comparison for the kind of startups that are typical for HN-types ~ certainly no early stage startup is going to hire a 10-year manager to be employee #1 when what they really need is a hotshot programmer.
- rdl 16y ago
  I admit my knowledge of stateside engineers in the large defense contractors is secondhand; trying to convert known deployed salaries and known eng and pm salaries at small product companies selling to usg. Substitute working for a fund on the dev side and double my numbers to make the original argument stronger.
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]