9 ms·

> "It's difficult even saying that with all the people that I know behind me that I hurt." It is interesting to think about who he considers he hurt. The poten

by rdtsc 9y ago

> "It's difficult even saying that with all the people that I know behind me that I hurt." It is interesting to think about who he considers he hurt. The potential winners who relied on lottery winning to secure a future for their families? The lottery workers? He is a criminal surely, but isn't the whole lottery system a tax on lack of education and it just gives false hope to people and encourages gambling. He reduced faith in it somehow being a random lottery so I guess he probably hurt the state income bottom line. At least in some states they claim to use lottery proceeding to improve math education - not sure how truthful that is.

SirFatty 9y ago
Lotto in Illinois was introduced as a way to help pay for public education. You can guess how that ended up... hell, they were not even paying the winners for a while (maybe they still are not).
- derekp7 9y ago
  The lottery does pay for education. And the pre-existing education funds were removed. Net gain in funding: 0.
  - koolba 9y ago
    Kind of funny how that works when money is fungible eh? Same thing happened, and continues to happen, with tobacco tax dollars.
  - SirFatty 9y ago
    Correct, here's a pretty good explanation. It's crazy really. https://www.wbez.org/shows/curious-city/why-the-illinois-lotterys-been-no-jackpot-for-schools/72a184e8-f0b7-4f0e-b2e0-3ff4313bffed https://www.wbez.org/shows/curious-city/why-the-illinois-lot...
- jrs235 9y ago
  Not only is Illinois not paying winners, they're aren't selling Powerball or Mega Millions or any multi-state lottery game. http://wgntv.com/2017/06/27/powerball-mega-millions-ticket-sales-to-be-suspended-prize-payments-delayed/ http://wgntv.com/2017/06/27/powerball-mega-millions-ticket-s...
  - notfromhere 9y ago
    This is outdated. They passed a budget
mrleiter 9y ago
I believe he refers to his loved ones.
- glitcher 9y ago
  This is the correct answer. He doesn't care about the lottery system, the states, or the potential winners that didn't get their chance. But getting busted for the crime hurts everyone who cares about him. > all the people that I know behind me that I hurt As in sitting directly behind him in the courtroom waiting for sentencing.
- rdtsc 9y ago
  Agreed. That's the right answer probably.
Isamu 9y ago
> a tax on lack of education I hear this a lot, but I think people know what a longshot is. Is this so much more stupid than throwing your money away on useless consumer junk?
- icebraining 9y ago
  Is this so much more stupid than throwing your money away on useless consumer junk? No, but so what?
- booleandilemma 9y ago
  I once read the lottery is a way of buying hope.
  - fitchjo 9y ago
    I play every once in awhile, when the jackpot gets to be large enough they start talking about it on TV. The $10 or $20 I spend is well worth daydreaming about the things I would if I won.
    - InitialLastName 9y ago
      Buy index funds and live off the proceeds?
      - goatforce5 9y ago
        Why not both?
      - chowells 9y ago
        I don't know about you, but I can't live off the proceeds from $10 in index funds. Not even if repeated 100 times.
        ZephyrP 9y ago
        The general principle here is right, but I was kind of curious about exactly what your gains would be. I curled the last 90 days from http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_3021-gainnyse-gainer.html http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_3021-gainnyse-gainer... and if you selected the largest percentage gainer every day for the past 100 days, given you started with $10, you'd have about 828 million after 90 days. (It's worth noting however with 2,800 stocks on the NYSE, that 2800^100 is much longer odds than winning the lottery. Actually, your odds of selected the very highest percentage stock gainer three days in a row are lower than your odds of winning the powerball, assuming such a thing is random). Unrelated, this has really been a winning quarter for logistics and trucking companies!
nothrabannosir 9y ago
> isn't the whole lottery system a tax on lack of education If anything, it's a tax on intensity of endorphin rushes. Aside from people who buy them for "fair" reasons, like... the "joke" factor, for example.
- tyingq 9y ago
  Agreed. There are plenty of highly educated people in casinos, or in very risky investments.
temp-dude-87844 9y ago
While I support the idea that lottery and gambling is for 'entertainment purposes only', if one never buys into the lottery, they can never obtain the winnings. Buying exactly one ticket per drawing at least places one in the pool of potential winners, despite the odds being rather long. Although the expected value is still minuscule, it's an unquantifiable improvement (since we can't divide by zero). And before you evoke any comparisons with the probabilities of getting struck by lightning or hit by meteors, none of those will ever pay you a nice chunk of cash. Investing the same amount of money in a financial device with higher assurances of returns is not a comparable experience, neither psychologically nor practically, even if we callously suppose that such instruments are in fact widely available across all cross-sections of society. Holding back the price of 1 ticket per drawing period from safer investments to gain a shot at a high-payout lottery is simply diversifying your investment portfolio.
- throwawaywonk 9y ago
  Actually, given the probability of winning, each lottery ticket has a negative value, so... yeah, there's no way it isn't a waste of money. "You gotta be in it to win it" is nonsense and is exactly what the lottery commission relies on.
- gnopgnip 9y ago
  It is a negative expected value. You can go below zero. There is no situation where buying lottery tickets is a good way to diversify your portfolio
  - slavik81 9y ago
    Well, there are some situations in which it's a good investment. http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/08/07/how-mit-students-scammed-the-massachusetts-lottery-for-8-million/ http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/08/07/how-mit-students-scammed...
  - Domenic_S 9y ago
    Nah, depending on jackpot size, Mega Millions at least can reach a +ev state. https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/957061-chris-demuth-jr/2505021-a-ev-lottery https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/957061-chris-demuth-jr/25...
jrs95 9y ago
Honestly I think if what he did reduces what people spend on lottery tickets, it was ultimately a good thing. It’s sad how much is wasted on that.
jacquesm 9y ago
I would go for the contrary interpretation: he helped people become wary of lotteries and showed them beyond a shadow of doubt that they could be rigged even if they appeared to be fair. He did in fact damage the lottery, not the non-lottery winners (in the aggregate maybe, but not in a specific way) other than that he hopefully vaccinated them and caused them to bow out of playing the lottery altogether thus saving themselves money they could not miss. It is more than just a little bit suspicious that in plenty of places where gambling is illegal the state owned lottery is legal. It's fine to gamble as long as the beneficiary is the state, never mind that on average only the lottery organizer gets ahead.
- rdtsc 9y ago
  > he helped people become wary of lotteries and showed them beyond a shadow of doubt that they could be rigged Yap, I was kind of hinting at that. What you said is a valid way to look at it. > It's fine to gamble as long as the beneficiary is the state, never mind that on average only the lottery organizer gets ahead. It's part of preying on the poor. Same with payday loans, and alcohol sales. Having lived in poor parts of town it's common to see all 3 being marketed and pushed heavily in those areas. They might claim they don't want to regulate payday loans because "free markets" whatnot, but state lotteries directly controlled by the government. The pretense they use is that proceeds pay for "education". Except even if it is true, then what happens is that education funds get reduced and used for something else because there are these "lottery funds" coming in. So somehow kids getting scholarships or teachers better salaries doesn't usually pan out as expected.
  - eric_h 9y ago
    > then what happens is that education funds get reduced and used for something else because there are these "lottery funds" coming in That's pretty much what happens, any time you inject funds from a new source into a thing, the other source of fund for said thing tends to get reduced.
hsod 9y ago
If McDonald's takes your money but doesn't give you your food, who has been hurt?
edgartaor 9y ago
>some states they claim to use lottery proceeding to improve math education About that, this video is worth watching. No that is 100% true, but good enough to start a conversation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PK-netuhHA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PK-netuhHA

by rdtsc 9y ago

SirFatty 9y ago

Lotto in Illinois was introduced as a way to help pay for public education. You can guess how that ended up... hell, they were not even paying the winners for a while (maybe they still are not).

derekp7 9y ago
The lottery does pay for education. And the pre-existing education funds were removed. Net gain in funding: 0.
- koolba 9y ago
  Kind of funny how that works when money is fungible eh? Same thing happened, and continues to happen, with tobacco tax dollars.
- SirFatty 9y ago
  Correct, here's a pretty good explanation. It's crazy really. https://www.wbez.org/shows/curious-city/why-the-illinois-lotterys-been-no-jackpot-for-schools/72a184e8-f0b7-4f0e-b2e0-3ff4313bffed https://www.wbez.org/shows/curious-city/why-the-illinois-lot...
jrs235 9y ago
Not only is Illinois not paying winners, they're aren't selling Powerball or Mega Millions or any multi-state lottery game. http://wgntv.com/2017/06/27/powerball-mega-millions-ticket-sales-to-be-suspended-prize-payments-delayed/ http://wgntv.com/2017/06/27/powerball-mega-millions-ticket-s...
- notfromhere 9y ago
  This is outdated. They passed a budget

mrleiter 9y ago

I believe he refers to his loved ones.

glitcher 9y ago
This is the correct answer. He doesn't care about the lottery system, the states, or the potential winners that didn't get their chance. But getting busted for the crime hurts everyone who cares about him. > all the people that I know behind me that I hurt As in sitting directly behind him in the courtroom waiting for sentencing.
rdtsc 9y ago
Agreed. That's the right answer probably.

Isamu 9y ago

> a tax on lack of education I hear this a lot, but I think people know what a longshot is. Is this so much more stupid than throwing your money away on useless consumer junk?

icebraining 9y ago
Is this so much more stupid than throwing your money away on useless consumer junk? No, but so what?
booleandilemma 9y ago
I once read the lottery is a way of buying hope.
- fitchjo 9y ago
  I play every once in awhile, when the jackpot gets to be large enough they start talking about it on TV. The $10 or $20 I spend is well worth daydreaming about the things I would if I won.
  - InitialLastName 9y ago
    Buy index funds and live off the proceeds?
    - goatforce5 9y ago
      Why not both?
    - chowells 9y ago
      I don't know about you, but I can't live off the proceeds from $10 in index funds. Not even if repeated 100 times.
      - ZephyrP 9y ago
        The general principle here is right, but I was kind of curious about exactly what your gains would be. I curled the last 90 days from http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_3021-gainnyse-gainer.html http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/page/2_3021-gainnyse-gainer... and if you selected the largest percentage gainer every day for the past 100 days, given you started with $10, you'd have about 828 million after 90 days. (It's worth noting however with 2,800 stocks on the NYSE, that 2800^100 is much longer odds than winning the lottery. Actually, your odds of selected the very highest percentage stock gainer three days in a row are lower than your odds of winning the powerball, assuming such a thing is random). Unrelated, this has really been a winning quarter for logistics and trucking companies!

nothrabannosir 9y ago

> isn't the whole lottery system a tax on lack of education If anything, it's a tax on intensity of endorphin rushes. Aside from people who buy them for "fair" reasons, like... the "joke" factor, for example.

tyingq 9y ago
Agreed. There are plenty of highly educated people in casinos, or in very risky investments.

temp-dude-87844 9y ago

While I support the idea that lottery and gambling is for 'entertainment purposes only', if one never buys into the lottery, they can never obtain the winnings. Buying exactly one ticket per drawing at least places one in the pool of potential winners, despite the odds being rather long. Although the expected value is still minuscule, it's an unquantifiable improvement (since we can't divide by zero). And before you evoke any comparisons with the probabilities of getting struck by lightning or hit by meteors, none of those will ever pay you a nice chunk of cash. Investing the same amount of money in a financial device with higher assurances of returns is not a comparable experience, neither psychologically nor practically, even if we callously suppose that such instruments are in fact widely available across all cross-sections of society. Holding back the price of 1 ticket per drawing period from safer investments to gain a shot at a high-payout lottery is simply diversifying your investment portfolio.

throwawaywonk 9y ago
Actually, given the probability of winning, each lottery ticket has a negative value, so... yeah, there's no way it isn't a waste of money. "You gotta be in it to win it" is nonsense and is exactly what the lottery commission relies on.
gnopgnip 9y ago
It is a negative expected value. You can go below zero. There is no situation where buying lottery tickets is a good way to diversify your portfolio
- slavik81 9y ago
  Well, there are some situations in which it's a good investment. http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/08/07/how-mit-students-scammed-the-massachusetts-lottery-for-8-million/ http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/08/07/how-mit-students-scammed...
- Domenic_S 9y ago
  Nah, depending on jackpot size, Mega Millions at least can reach a +ev state. https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/957061-chris-demuth-jr/2505021-a-ev-lottery https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/957061-chris-demuth-jr/25...

jrs95 9y ago

Honestly I think if what he did reduces what people spend on lottery tickets, it was ultimately a good thing. It’s sad how much is wasted on that.

jacquesm 9y ago

I would go for the contrary interpretation: he helped people become wary of lotteries and showed them beyond a shadow of doubt that they could be rigged even if they appeared to be fair. He did in fact damage the lottery, not the non-lottery winners (in the aggregate maybe, but not in a specific way) other than that he hopefully vaccinated them and caused them to bow out of playing the lottery altogether thus saving themselves money they could not miss. It is more than just a little bit suspicious that in plenty of places where gambling is illegal the state owned lottery is legal. It's fine to gamble as long as the beneficiary is the state, never mind that on average only the lottery organizer gets ahead.

rdtsc 9y ago
> he helped people become wary of lotteries and showed them beyond a shadow of doubt that they could be rigged Yap, I was kind of hinting at that. What you said is a valid way to look at it. > It's fine to gamble as long as the beneficiary is the state, never mind that on average only the lottery organizer gets ahead. It's part of preying on the poor. Same with payday loans, and alcohol sales. Having lived in poor parts of town it's common to see all 3 being marketed and pushed heavily in those areas. They might claim they don't want to regulate payday loans because "free markets" whatnot, but state lotteries directly controlled by the government. The pretense they use is that proceeds pay for "education". Except even if it is true, then what happens is that education funds get reduced and used for something else because there are these "lottery funds" coming in. So somehow kids getting scholarships or teachers better salaries doesn't usually pan out as expected.
- eric_h 9y ago
  > then what happens is that education funds get reduced and used for something else because there are these "lottery funds" coming in That's pretty much what happens, any time you inject funds from a new source into a thing, the other source of fund for said thing tends to get reduced.

hsod 9y ago

If McDonald's takes your money but doesn't give you your food, who has been hurt?

edgartaor 9y ago

>some states they claim to use lottery proceeding to improve math education About that, this video is worth watching. No that is 100% true, but good enough to start a conversation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PK-netuhHA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PK-netuhHA