5 ms·

> It's not like there's a simple form that you can fill and which is reviewed and resolved in a few days reliably if your account gets deactivated by mistake.

> It's not like there's a simple form that you can fill and which is reviewed and resolved in a few days reliably if your account gets deactivated by mistake. Even a few days is unacceptable. There are times in my life where, if my Google Calendar, Google Docs, and email had all been shut off simultaneously, even for only a few days, I would have been completely fucked. Think travel, etc. I switched to a different email provider for this reason. (Remember that this also includes your phone, if you're on an Android device).

Silhouette 9y ago
(Remember that this also includes your phone, if you're on an Android device). Is that inherent in using Android, or only if you use Google's own apps and online storage for your calendar etc?
- chimeracoder 9y ago
  It's not inherent in AOSP, but it's true for most Android users.
ucaetano 9y ago
> Even a few days is unacceptable. There are times in my life where, if my Google Calendar, Google Docs, and email had all been shut off simultaneously, even for only a few days, I would have been completely fucked. Think travel, etc. If you want that level of service, maybe you shouldn't use a free product. You can have a free product, or you can have good, responsive, human customer service. You can't have both. If you chose a free product, be ready to handle the consequences of your decision like everybody else.
- chimeracoder 9y ago
  > If you want that level of service, maybe you shouldn't use a free product. ...did you not read the part where I said I switched to a different provider? And I was a paying customer - I had a Google Apps account, which comes with an annual fee for providing those services. Of course, the problem isn't about me personally - it's that so many other, less technically savvy people aren't aware of how vulnerable they are to this problem. They don't think about it until it happens to them. > You can have a free product, or you can have good, responsive, human customer service. You can't have both This dichotomy is both reductive and inapplicable. The problem, as explained in this thread, is that Google has a reputation for bad service, even for their paid offerings. It exists, which is more than can be said of the support for the free products, but it's still not good enough. And again, most customers aren't aware of the extent of this and its implications until it's too late.
  - ucaetano 9y ago
    > They don't think about it until it happens to them. Agreed, and doesn't need to be less tech-savvy people, just look at HN. People seem to expect good and free service. > This dichotomy is both reductive and inapplicable. And is still unavoidable. You can't have both. > And again, most customers aren't aware of the extent of this and its implications until it's too late. It is the same behavior with airline tickets. Consumers almost always buy the cheapest ticket, and later complain about the quality of the service.
    - chimeracoder 9y ago
      > You can't have both. It is entirely irrelevant to this thread and discussion. We are talking about the service for one paid product (Google Apps), on a thread announcing the service for another paid product (Google Chrome Enterprise).
      - ucaetano 9y ago
        > We are talking about the service for one paid product (Google Apps), on a thread announcing the service for another paid product (Google Chrome Enterprise). No, OP is talking about this case, which is a free product: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15065742 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15065742
    - sgc 9y ago
      Although I agree with the sentiment of your post, I do not consider the use of google products even close to free. It comes with a heavy price to pay in privacy, and they do make a significant amount of money from each customer they can keep in the herd. Google is probably a main reason why people think they can expect quality and free. But google will never provide service unless they hemorrhage customers over it -- despite the fact that their income could more than support some basic customer service -- at least to actually review suspended accounts and give people a reasonable chance to explain themselves. I am sure the first objection will be "you don't actually pay". Does a farmer not owe his (cash) cow at least basic veterinary (customer) services? I honestly feel like that objection is as naive as claiming that exploitative international trade doesn't actually kill anybody, when there are entire populations held in poverty and without basic safety rights over decades or even centuries due to unjust practices. So I guess the counterpoint to "it's free, don't expect anything" is "if you can't provide a complete product including understanding the problems that derive from it and treating people with respect, you shouldn't offer it at all". Money does not define social responsibility, engaging publicly with other people does.
- gogopuppygogo 9y ago
  I'm reading this thinking the same thing. I've never put myself in a position where a freeware product had that much impact on my life. Heck I even pay to backup the paid services to a third party so I have a failover there. You shouldn't blame Google, you should blame yourself.
- kartickv 9y ago
  I don't mind paying Google say ₹50 a month for the ability to reach a customer service agent when things go wrong. And one who's actually empowered to fix things, not a mindless drone. Just because it's a consumer (rather than business) account doesn't mean we shouldn't have customer service, if we're willing to pay for it. There's no reason Google can't cater to us while also providing no-service free products.
  - ucaetano 9y ago
    > I don't mind paying Google say ₹50 a month for the ability to reach a customer service agent when things go wrong. And one who's actually empowered to fix things, not a mindless drone. I'd bet that type of customer service costs far more than that. > Just because it's a consumer (rather than business) account doesn't mean we shouldn't have customer service, if we're willing to pay for it. There's no reason Google can't cater to us while also providing no-service free products. And I'd bet there are too few consumers willing to pay for it to justify Google offering. It is the old argumentum ad capitalismum, if it would make money, I'm sure Google would offer it.
    - kartickv 9y ago
      Then increase the fee. BTW, it's like insurance — I expect to pay the fee whether or not I actually use customer service. It's not that I'll pay the fee only when I actually talk to customer service. If it's the latter model, the fee could be higher, like, "Pay ₹1000 and get service for the next month." Even if few people are paying for it, it's worth it to address the negative perception about Google. You seem to be assuming that Google (or any other company) does everything right, so if they're not doing it, it's a bad idea. That's not true. Companies make mistakes all the time.
      - whyagaindavid 9y ago
        If you need 24/7 support get a mail account at a provider who has a tech office near your home/office. In my uni most people do not care if they lose their gmail
whyagaindavid 9y ago
To helpful please name your provider

Silhouette 9y ago

(Remember that this also includes your phone, if you're on an Android device). Is that inherent in using Android, or only if you use Google's own apps and online storage for your calendar etc?

chimeracoder 9y ago
It's not inherent in AOSP, but it's true for most Android users.

ucaetano 9y ago

> Even a few days is unacceptable. There are times in my life where, if my Google Calendar, Google Docs, and email had all been shut off simultaneously, even for only a few days, I would have been completely fucked. Think travel, etc. If you want that level of service, maybe you shouldn't use a free product. You can have a free product, or you can have good, responsive, human customer service. You can't have both. If you chose a free product, be ready to handle the consequences of your decision like everybody else.

chimeracoder 9y ago
> If you want that level of service, maybe you shouldn't use a free product. ...did you not read the part where I said I switched to a different provider? And I was a paying customer - I had a Google Apps account, which comes with an annual fee for providing those services. Of course, the problem isn't about me personally - it's that so many other, less technically savvy people aren't aware of how vulnerable they are to this problem. They don't think about it until it happens to them. > You can have a free product, or you can have good, responsive, human customer service. You can't have both This dichotomy is both reductive and inapplicable. The problem, as explained in this thread, is that Google has a reputation for bad service, even for their paid offerings. It exists, which is more than can be said of the support for the free products, but it's still not good enough. And again, most customers aren't aware of the extent of this and its implications until it's too late.
- ucaetano 9y ago
  > They don't think about it until it happens to them. Agreed, and doesn't need to be less tech-savvy people, just look at HN. People seem to expect good and free service. > This dichotomy is both reductive and inapplicable. And is still unavoidable. You can't have both. > And again, most customers aren't aware of the extent of this and its implications until it's too late. It is the same behavior with airline tickets. Consumers almost always buy the cheapest ticket, and later complain about the quality of the service.
  - chimeracoder 9y ago
    > You can't have both. It is entirely irrelevant to this thread and discussion. We are talking about the service for one paid product (Google Apps), on a thread announcing the service for another paid product (Google Chrome Enterprise).
    - ucaetano 9y ago
      > We are talking about the service for one paid product (Google Apps), on a thread announcing the service for another paid product (Google Chrome Enterprise). No, OP is talking about this case, which is a free product: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15065742 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15065742
  - sgc 9y ago
    Although I agree with the sentiment of your post, I do not consider the use of google products even close to free. It comes with a heavy price to pay in privacy, and they do make a significant amount of money from each customer they can keep in the herd. Google is probably a main reason why people think they can expect quality and free. But google will never provide service unless they hemorrhage customers over it -- despite the fact that their income could more than support some basic customer service -- at least to actually review suspended accounts and give people a reasonable chance to explain themselves. I am sure the first objection will be "you don't actually pay". Does a farmer not owe his (cash) cow at least basic veterinary (customer) services? I honestly feel like that objection is as naive as claiming that exploitative international trade doesn't actually kill anybody, when there are entire populations held in poverty and without basic safety rights over decades or even centuries due to unjust practices. So I guess the counterpoint to "it's free, don't expect anything" is "if you can't provide a complete product including understanding the problems that derive from it and treating people with respect, you shouldn't offer it at all". Money does not define social responsibility, engaging publicly with other people does.
gogopuppygogo 9y ago
I'm reading this thinking the same thing. I've never put myself in a position where a freeware product had that much impact on my life. Heck I even pay to backup the paid services to a third party so I have a failover there. You shouldn't blame Google, you should blame yourself.
kartickv 9y ago
I don't mind paying Google say ₹50 a month for the ability to reach a customer service agent when things go wrong. And one who's actually empowered to fix things, not a mindless drone. Just because it's a consumer (rather than business) account doesn't mean we shouldn't have customer service, if we're willing to pay for it. There's no reason Google can't cater to us while also providing no-service free products.
- ucaetano 9y ago
  > I don't mind paying Google say ₹50 a month for the ability to reach a customer service agent when things go wrong. And one who's actually empowered to fix things, not a mindless drone. I'd bet that type of customer service costs far more than that. > Just because it's a consumer (rather than business) account doesn't mean we shouldn't have customer service, if we're willing to pay for it. There's no reason Google can't cater to us while also providing no-service free products. And I'd bet there are too few consumers willing to pay for it to justify Google offering. It is the old argumentum ad capitalismum, if it would make money, I'm sure Google would offer it.
  - kartickv 9y ago
    Then increase the fee. BTW, it's like insurance — I expect to pay the fee whether or not I actually use customer service. It's not that I'll pay the fee only when I actually talk to customer service. If it's the latter model, the fee could be higher, like, "Pay ₹1000 and get service for the next month." Even if few people are paying for it, it's worth it to address the negative perception about Google. You seem to be assuming that Google (or any other company) does everything right, so if they're not doing it, it's a bad idea. That's not true. Companies make mistakes all the time.
    - whyagaindavid 9y ago
      If you need 24/7 support get a mail account at a provider who has a tech office near your home/office. In my uni most people do not care if they lose their gmail

whyagaindavid 9y ago

To helpful please name your provider