6 ms·

>Honestly, I might have considered dating him had he been >less arrogant and less married. Ah, I see. If you are attractive enough, suddenly it is not sexual

>Honestly, I might have considered dating him had he been >less arrogant and less married. Ah, I see. If you are attractive enough, suddenly it is not sexual harassment anymore. I am not going to have a shred of compassion for any woman in tech who complains about harassment, while mentioning the dating opportunities that happen to come.

khazhoux 9y ago
What an odd criticism to make. She's stating that his arrogance and marital status made him unattractive, as he was coming on to her. A perfectly valid way to feel, no?
- AnonNo15 9y ago
  Rejecting his advances was fine. What disturbed me is that given different circumstances she would have dated him without second thoughts and suddenly "harassment" becomes a healthy relationship. It means that similar actions would end up in different outcomes. Then where is the line between the harassment and non-harassment?
  - khazhoux 9y ago
    Read the article please. Her complaint is about his behavior after she turned him down, and his sexual advances towards another partner. > ... Ajit had grown increasingly hostile toward me, excluding me from information and meetings > Back at Kleiner, I continued to have a huge problem with Ajit. Not only was he blocking my work, he had been promoted to a position of even greater responsibility and was giving me negative reviews. I started to lodge formal complaints about him. In response, the firm suggested I transfer to the China office. > But when I told fellow junior partner... she grew uncharacteristically quiet. Then she said something I never expected: She had been harassed by Ajit, too. He’d asked her out for drinks to talk shop, and in the course of the evening he started touching her with his leg under the table. > Later that night he came to her room in his bathrobe, asking to be let in. She eventually had to push him out the door.
  - Powerofmene 9y ago
    What is SEXUAL HARASSMENT? definition of SEXUAL HARASSMENT (Black's Law Dictionary) Harrassment in the workplace or discrimination where unwelcome and unwanted advances are made to a person by one or more other employees. The comments are of a personal nature and often sexual in style and manner. Clearly the conversation on the airplane, private jet or not, was inappropriate. To your other point, If she would have dated him under different circumstances, if those different circumstances had existed then his request for her company at dinner (aka a date) would most likely not have been unwelcome or unwanted. Most mature women will not cry harassment if asked to dinner and they turn the individual down and the individual accepts said rejection without further pursuit or retaliation for the rejection. Again, I said most, not all or none, but most. This is the reason that many companies have no workplace relationship rules. Personally speaking, I do not care how handsome you are, if you show up at my hotel room door in a bathrobe without me having invited you (and even if I had what makes you think you were invited for sex so why are you in your bathrobe?) and you work in a position that can exercise power over my employment, you are not exercising good judgment at all. Why would you not think that your actions might be unwelcome or unwanted?
dang 9y ago
> Ah, I see. If you are attractive enough, suddenly it is not sexual harassment That's not in the least a charitable version of what she said, and this is a generic talking point of the kind that always moves discussions in a less substantive, more angry direction (as indeed you moved yourself in the next paragraph). Please make a u-turn and post the opposite kind of comment here, or no comment.
- AnonNo15 9y ago
  No, I will not post any comment in opposite direction, and neither I will keep silent. If society wants to remove sexual harassment from work environment , then both genders need to adjust their behavior, not just men. For women it means zero exceptions allowed for dating at work, even if the guy is attractive. Or going all in and accepting the dating and sexual advances from coworkers, however that would mean forfeiting the "sexual harassment" cliche.
  - khazhoux 9y ago
    You're setting up a strawman. No one is trying to prohibit dating at work. What's prohibited is retaliatory actions (or threats of retaliation) when someone is turned down.
    - AnonNo15 9y ago
      That was not my point. My point is that the issue "I don't want to be sexually harassed at work" becomes "I don't want to be sexually harassed at work by unattractive men", but the parties in question are not willing to articulate it fully.
      - dang 9y ago
        You've posted four comments to this thread based on an elementary misinterpretation of the author. Doing that, especially in a bilious way, is a violation of the site guidelines. Please (re)-read them and follow them when commenting here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

khazhoux 9y ago

What an odd criticism to make. She's stating that his arrogance and marital status made him unattractive, as he was coming on to her. A perfectly valid way to feel, no?

AnonNo15 9y ago
Rejecting his advances was fine. What disturbed me is that given different circumstances she would have dated him without second thoughts and suddenly "harassment" becomes a healthy relationship. It means that similar actions would end up in different outcomes. Then where is the line between the harassment and non-harassment?
- khazhoux 9y ago
  Read the article please. Her complaint is about his behavior after she turned him down, and his sexual advances towards another partner. > ... Ajit had grown increasingly hostile toward me, excluding me from information and meetings > Back at Kleiner, I continued to have a huge problem with Ajit. Not only was he blocking my work, he had been promoted to a position of even greater responsibility and was giving me negative reviews. I started to lodge formal complaints about him. In response, the firm suggested I transfer to the China office. > But when I told fellow junior partner... she grew uncharacteristically quiet. Then she said something I never expected: She had been harassed by Ajit, too. He’d asked her out for drinks to talk shop, and in the course of the evening he started touching her with his leg under the table. > Later that night he came to her room in his bathrobe, asking to be let in. She eventually had to push him out the door.
- Powerofmene 9y ago
  What is SEXUAL HARASSMENT? definition of SEXUAL HARASSMENT (Black's Law Dictionary) Harrassment in the workplace or discrimination where unwelcome and unwanted advances are made to a person by one or more other employees. The comments are of a personal nature and often sexual in style and manner. Clearly the conversation on the airplane, private jet or not, was inappropriate. To your other point, If she would have dated him under different circumstances, if those different circumstances had existed then his request for her company at dinner (aka a date) would most likely not have been unwelcome or unwanted. Most mature women will not cry harassment if asked to dinner and they turn the individual down and the individual accepts said rejection without further pursuit or retaliation for the rejection. Again, I said most, not all or none, but most. This is the reason that many companies have no workplace relationship rules. Personally speaking, I do not care how handsome you are, if you show up at my hotel room door in a bathrobe without me having invited you (and even if I had what makes you think you were invited for sex so why are you in your bathrobe?) and you work in a position that can exercise power over my employment, you are not exercising good judgment at all. Why would you not think that your actions might be unwelcome or unwanted?

dang 9y ago

> Ah, I see. If you are attractive enough, suddenly it is not sexual harassment That's not in the least a charitable version of what she said, and this is a generic talking point of the kind that always moves discussions in a less substantive, more angry direction (as indeed you moved yourself in the next paragraph). Please make a u-turn and post the opposite kind of comment here, or no comment.

AnonNo15 9y ago
No, I will not post any comment in opposite direction, and neither I will keep silent. If society wants to remove sexual harassment from work environment , then both genders need to adjust their behavior, not just men. For women it means zero exceptions allowed for dating at work, even if the guy is attractive. Or going all in and accepting the dating and sexual advances from coworkers, however that would mean forfeiting the "sexual harassment" cliche.
- khazhoux 9y ago
  You're setting up a strawman. No one is trying to prohibit dating at work. What's prohibited is retaliatory actions (or threats of retaliation) when someone is turned down.
  - AnonNo15 9y ago
    That was not my point. My point is that the issue "I don't want to be sexually harassed at work" becomes "I don't want to be sexually harassed at work by unattractive men", but the parties in question are not willing to articulate it fully.
    - dang 9y ago
      You've posted four comments to this thread based on an elementary misinterpretation of the author. Doing that, especially in a bilious way, is a violation of the site guidelines. Please (re)-read them and follow them when commenting here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html