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The problem is if you ever found facebook infringing on one of your patents, you could not sue them -- your react patent grant would be rescinded. This is not

The problem is if you ever found facebook infringing on one of your patents, you could not sue them -- your react patent grant would be rescinded. This is not a behavior of free software.

littlecranky67 9y ago
This is the same BS repeated on HN almost every day now. You can sue FB anytime, whether you use React or not. You do not give them any kind of permission to use YOUR patents just by using React. The only thing that happens when you sue FB over patents is that your patent grant covering React is gone, reducing your license to a regular BSD license. If you use Angular, vue or whatnot open source products covered by licenses without patents grants, there is NO guarantee whatsoever that this piece of software is free from patents of Google, FB, Oracle your favorite patent troll from around the corner. Yet people seem more fine with using software which comes without any patent grants whatsoever, and declare that hell would come over us if the FB patent grant on the software would be revoked. Btw, clauses that revoke patent grants when you sue a party are pretty regular and present in the Apache License v2 and the (L)GPLv3, no one is crying about it and says that those licenses are not open source anymore. The GPLv3 goes even further and invalidates your right to use the software at all if you start sueing people who created that software. Gosh, I am so happy to live in the EU where we do not have to deal with this kind of BS and can just use the best technology that solves the problem.
- BukhariH 9y ago
  Wait... I live in the EU aswell (UK). What do you mean by: "Gosh, I am so happy to live in the EU where we do not have to deal with this kind of BS and can just use the best technology that solves the problem."
  - fstephany 9y ago
    Software Patenting theoretically does not exist in the EU[1]. But in practice I guess it's up to the interpretation of the law by national courts. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patents_under_the_European_Patent_Convention https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patents_under_the_Eur...
- anilgulecha 9y ago
  You're responding to something I never claimed. My only point was Free Software (in spirit) does not take away (patent)rights once they've been granted.
- Sacho 9y ago
  I agree that it is frustrating to have to constantly push back against the hysteria around the license, however, I think parent was correct in their initial assertion - "The problem is if you ever found facebook infringing on one of your patents, you could not sue them -- your react patent grant would be rescinded.". While rescinding the patent grant does not remove your license to use the product, I've seen some lawyers argue that Facebook's license is weaker than a "regular BSD license". The argument goes that a "regular BSD license" has an implicit patent grant that is stronger than what the React license offers through its explicit patent grant. Thus, you are not reverting to a "regular BSD license", you are reverting to a "regular BSD license MINUS the implicit patent grant". (http://en.swpat.org/wiki/Implicit_patent_licence#USA http://en.swpat.org/wiki/Implicit_patent_licence#USA) (IANAL so I have no particular understanding whether this is a good legal argument, but assuming it is, it seems like a strong counterpoint).

The problem is if you ever found facebook infringing on one of your patents, you could not sue them -- your react patent grant would be rescinded. This is not a behavior of free software.

littlecranky67 9y ago

This is the same BS repeated on HN almost every day now. You can sue FB anytime, whether you use React or not. You do not give them any kind of permission to use YOUR patents just by using React. The only thing that happens when you sue FB over patents is that your patent grant covering React is gone, reducing your license to a regular BSD license. If you use Angular, vue or whatnot open source products covered by licenses without patents grants, there is NO guarantee whatsoever that this piece of software is free from patents of Google, FB, Oracle your favorite patent troll from around the corner. Yet people seem more fine with using software which comes without any patent grants whatsoever, and declare that hell would come over us if the FB patent grant on the software would be revoked. Btw, clauses that revoke patent grants when you sue a party are pretty regular and present in the Apache License v2 and the (L)GPLv3, no one is crying about it and says that those licenses are not open source anymore. The GPLv3 goes even further and invalidates your right to use the software at all if you start sueing people who created that software. Gosh, I am so happy to live in the EU where we do not have to deal with this kind of BS and can just use the best technology that solves the problem.

BukhariH 9y ago
Wait... I live in the EU aswell (UK). What do you mean by: "Gosh, I am so happy to live in the EU where we do not have to deal with this kind of BS and can just use the best technology that solves the problem."
- fstephany 9y ago
  Software Patenting theoretically does not exist in the EU[1]. But in practice I guess it's up to the interpretation of the law by national courts. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patents_under_the_European_Patent_Convention https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patents_under_the_Eur...
anilgulecha 9y ago
You're responding to something I never claimed. My only point was Free Software (in spirit) does not take away (patent)rights once they've been granted.
Sacho 9y ago
I agree that it is frustrating to have to constantly push back against the hysteria around the license, however, I think parent was correct in their initial assertion - "The problem is if you ever found facebook infringing on one of your patents, you could not sue them -- your react patent grant would be rescinded.". While rescinding the patent grant does not remove your license to use the product, I've seen some lawyers argue that Facebook's license is weaker than a "regular BSD license". The argument goes that a "regular BSD license" has an implicit patent grant that is stronger than what the React license offers through its explicit patent grant. Thus, you are not reverting to a "regular BSD license", you are reverting to a "regular BSD license MINUS the implicit patent grant". (http://en.swpat.org/wiki/Implicit_patent_licence#USA http://en.swpat.org/wiki/Implicit_patent_licence#USA) (IANAL so I have no particular understanding whether this is a good legal argument, but assuming it is, it seems like a strong counterpoint).