3 ms·

"The point of contention here is that you think cheating will always catch up to you." so taking away grades will get rid of cheating? People that have the ch

by rick888 16y ago

"The point of contention here is that you think cheating will always catch up to you." so taking away grades will get rid of cheating? People that have the cheating mindset will just find some other way to shortcut success. "I'm saying that the world is not so liquid and ideal. Someone cheating, assuming they do it right (and don't over do it), will probably get more than they deserve (in an idea world) before they die, if they did everything 100% by the book. Simple karmic forces (the cause-effect force) dictate that if you cheat constantly, you will increase your chances of being caught and punished. However people don't live forever, so it's highly possible they will get more than they deserve in their lifetime if they cheat." This is true, but there is usually more effort (or just as much) with cheating than doing it right. It's also not a long-term solution. As an example, I go to the blackhatseo forum from time to time. The people there do anything they possibly can to cheat people out of money and game as many systems as they can. What I've noticed is that most people get caught (and kicked out of wherever they were trying to make money) or their reputation gets tarnished every couple of months and they need to start over. If they just put that same effort into a legitimate business, they could slowly build a client base over time and if it's successful (which has just as much of a chance as the illegitimate methods), they won't have to hide or move every few months. Cheaters, like these people are only focusing on short-term gains..which is foolish. Will they get ahead or make money? To some degree, yes, but it will almost always catch up with them. "I think if you look at it from afar, you may not notice the inequity caused by cheating. I really can't really say how much cheating impacts society, but I definitely disagree with you on your claim that cheating is always (or at least to a point of insignificancy) caught/punished accordingly." It seems like this is a personal issue for you. Is there someone ahead of you at work that you feel shouldn't be there because they cheated? I'm looking at it closely, and I still really don't see all of these cheaters you are talking about. Do you have some examples?

chrischen 16y ago
You're right, cheating is not something to live by as an absolute philosophy. But no doubt people lie or cheat often and many may get away with it. > I'm looking at it closely, and I still really don't see all of these cheaters you are talking about. Do you have some examples? Nope. In fact, I don't even have anecdotal evidence. But my belief is that many people will get away with one or two instances of cheating here and there. Sure cheating will catch up to people, but it does so slowly (unless you constantly cheat). Not everyone does it because they are sociopathic. Some people do it because they think the end justifies the means. And because I think a lot of people believe (or at least tolerate it) in that mantra, I think a lot of them will justify cheating to get ahead slightly (perhaps to get what they think they deserve). Plus, I'm hearing all the time about how kids at MIT and what not cheat. Do I think they will get screwed in life for doing it once in a while? No, because they probably don't believe it's a good way of life. Do I care? No. Why do I not care? Well I'd only care if I can prove that someone's cheating directly adversely affected me. Otherwise, they can do whatever they want and the natural forces of cause and effect will balance it all out. That is, if it affects someone else directly, it's up to them to decide to care or not. But I absolutely agree with you that constant cheating is not sustainable. In fact, in general, any actions which might piss other people off is not sustainable and takes more effort to maintain. But I think there's a lot of people doing occasional cheating/lying, mainly justified because they believe the end justifies the means. And these instances of cheating and lying may not in the end matter because "catching up" takes a long time, or because whatever they did just happened to be practically justified by the end result. I personally don't believe in the end justifying the means, which is why I refuse to cheat or lie. If I can't get good grades then either something is wrong with the education system or I'm retarded. I'd rather believe the former. But the last thing I'd do is to pretend there is not problem with the education system (hypothetically speaking).

by rick888 16y ago

chrischen 16y ago

You're right, cheating is not something to live by as an absolute philosophy. But no doubt people lie or cheat often and many may get away with it. > I'm looking at it closely, and I still really don't see all of these cheaters you are talking about. Do you have some examples? Nope. In fact, I don't even have anecdotal evidence. But my belief is that many people will get away with one or two instances of cheating here and there. Sure cheating will catch up to people, but it does so slowly (unless you constantly cheat). Not everyone does it because they are sociopathic. Some people do it because they think the end justifies the means. And because I think a lot of people believe (or at least tolerate it) in that mantra, I think a lot of them will justify cheating to get ahead slightly (perhaps to get what they think they deserve). Plus, I'm hearing all the time about how kids at MIT and what not cheat. Do I think they will get screwed in life for doing it once in a while? No, because they probably don't believe it's a good way of life. Do I care? No. Why do I not care? Well I'd only care if I can prove that someone's cheating directly adversely affected me. Otherwise, they can do whatever they want and the natural forces of cause and effect will balance it all out. That is, if it affects someone else directly, it's up to them to decide to care or not. But I absolutely agree with you that constant cheating is not sustainable. In fact, in general, any actions which might piss other people off is not sustainable and takes more effort to maintain. But I think there's a lot of people doing occasional cheating/lying, mainly justified because they believe the end justifies the means. And these instances of cheating and lying may not in the end matter because "catching up" takes a long time, or because whatever they did just happened to be practically justified by the end result. I personally don't believe in the end justifying the means, which is why I refuse to cheat or lie. If I can't get good grades then either something is wrong with the education system or I'm retarded. I'd rather believe the former. But the last thing I'd do is to pretend there is not problem with the education system (hypothetically speaking).