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Sorry for the late response. I haven't gone to the links yet but the quotes in italics give me pause. They seem to be at pains to state things in a way which lo

by gmarx 9y ago

Sorry for the late response. I haven't gone to the links yet but the quotes in italics give me pause. They seem to be at pains to state things in a way which looks like it means one thing but may mean another. The second sentence is a nice start to an investigation but is not evidence really, just a temporal association. The third sentence is about poverty, not integration. The fact that the gap is larger in segregated districts is difficult to interpret without knowing if the comparison is to the population as a whole (i.e. blacks in the district to whites as a whole) or within the district (i.e. blacks in the district to whites in the district). I'd also want to know if how those districts compared to other districts. Were these high achieving schools? Low achieving? Somewhere in the middle?

frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
I guess if I were to boil it down it'd come to this. If integration doesn't help minority students then you have to believe in seperate but equal. If you don't believe that our schools are seperate but equal then you should be in favor of integration so that everybody has ownership in the problems our schools and children face. But I mean let's be honest here, are you really going to accept that integration worked? I'd like to believe it but experience tells me probably not. Because of the backfire effect I don't think you're likely to be convinced by some guy on the internet quoting social science research (especially since no research is perfect.) So here, let me give you a more human element. Here's three This American Life episodes, the first two are explicitly about integration and the third is about kids from a poor, public school visiting a rich, private school which is slightly less topical but helps to get the point across I think. Just listen and consider please. https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/562/the-problem-we-all-live-with https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/562/... https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/563/the-problem-we-all-live-with-part-two https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/563/... https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/550/three-miles https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/550/...

by gmarx 9y ago

frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago

I guess if I were to boil it down it'd come to this. If integration doesn't help minority students then you have to believe in seperate but equal. If you don't believe that our schools are seperate but equal then you should be in favor of integration so that everybody has ownership in the problems our schools and children face. But I mean let's be honest here, are you really going to accept that integration worked? I'd like to believe it but experience tells me probably not. Because of the backfire effect I don't think you're likely to be convinced by some guy on the internet quoting social science research (especially since no research is perfect.) So here, let me give you a more human element. Here's three This American Life episodes, the first two are explicitly about integration and the third is about kids from a poor, public school visiting a rich, private school which is slightly less topical but helps to get the point across I think. Just listen and consider please. https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/562/the-problem-we-all-live-with https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/562/... https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/563/the-problem-we-all-live-with-part-two https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/563/... https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/550/three-miles https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/550/...