6 ms·
They don't mention if it's possible to build saws without sawstop patents. Is this guy lobbying for all saw companies to be required to license his technology?
by readams 9y ago
They don't mention if it's possible to build saws without sawstop patents. Is this guy lobbying for all saw companies to be required to license his technology?
EDIT: It appears that they're currently suing Bosch for developing their own similar technology.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- antongribok 9y agoNot just suing, they have an injunction and at the moment you can't buy a saw in the USA with Bosch's REAXX technology, which actually works quite differently than SawStop. Here are two videos where you can compare for yourself: SawStop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3mzhvMgrLE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3mzhvMgrLE Bosch REAXX: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4heF0Y2-QYc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4heF0Y2-QYc Here's an article that talks about the lawsuit: https://www.protoolreviews.com/news/sawstop-vs-bosch-reaxx-lawsuit-not-yet/26066/ https://www.protoolreviews.com/news/sawstop-vs-bosch-reaxx-l...
- Sniffnoy 9y agoClarification: If I'm understanding this right, the stopping the saw works differently, but the detection works the same.
- randyrand 9y agoSo they are patenting capacitive sensing in the context of detecting a finger? you know, like a touchscreen? Wow. The USPO fucking sucks. For the record, I don't even know how the sensing actually works in the saws. I'm just guessing because its fricken OBVIOUS.
- joosters 9y agoSo many things seem obvious after they are explained. Fact is, no-one had built this kind of thing before sawstop. If it were so obvious, how come only one company did it?
- GauntletWizard 9y agoBecause they got a patent right as the technology became feasible.
- joosters 9y agoReally? Which bits of the technology were infeasible prior to this?
- jessaustin 9y ago2004 was a long time ago. Can we just assume for the sake of discussion that the state of the art in electronic devices was different then?
- joosters 9y agoWe're talking about a small piece of circuitry that detects a current. This was possible in 2004, it was hardly the dark age of electronics back then. Besides, the more complex part of the sawstop, at least to my eyes, is the part where you have to stop a big metal blade from spinning very fast ASAP. Just putting some brake pads on it like a bicycle wheel is not going to be good enough.
- balfirevic 9y agoPoster above said that the stopping works differently in Bosch saw.
- jononor 9y agoAny electric motor can be ran as a generator, which can be used to do electronic braking. It is the foundation for regenerative braking on electric cars and often used on big trailer trucks as the primary braking system.
- raverbashing 9y agoIt would be fun if Bosch countersued with some of their patents (but I guess most of table saw patents are expired now) Yes, this seems like rent-seeking on SawStop so they can go and eat a sausage. As a sibling comment said, detecting the finger is the obvious part (and there should be ample prior art)
- syrrim 9y agoThey aren't suing based on the finger detection - they're suing based on the retraction method.
- kashkhan 9y agoif he really cared about fingers, he would sell the patent for a million and save thousands of fingers a year. Just like volvo gave up the three point belt patent for public interest.
- captainmuon 9y agoAnd since they are suing, people can't buy Bosch's technology, and probably a lot less saw-stoppers are installed. Also, it seems the SawStop version is destructive, as opposed to Bosch's. That means you have an expense every time it fires. So this lawsuit is causing a lot of lost fingers, and some lost money. It would be really funny (although unrealistic) if somebody could be held responsible for all damages caused by the lawsuit.
- DanBC 9y agoYou have an expense with the Bosch system - you have to replace the explosive cartridges.
- DiThi 9y agoBosch system is cheaper in comparison: You have to replace the cartridges (~$156) which can fire twice (so 78 per activation). With SawStop you have to buy both the break ($69) and the saw (15-100? depends on the saw). Prices taken from amazon.com (so I don't know how realistic they are, the cartridge may actually be much cheaper, I don't know where to look at the official price)
- beambot 9y agoHow did seatbelts in cars overcome this issue? Are there loopholes available for "overwhelming societal influence"?
- nickhalfasleep 9y agoIn the case of three-point seatbelts, Volvo gave the patent away. "They decided that the invention was so significant, it had more value as a free life saving tool than something to profit from." http://jalopnik.com/volvo-gave-away-their-most-important-invention-to-save-1069825878 http://jalopnik.com/volvo-gave-away-their-most-important-inv...
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- pc86 9y agoVolvo held the patent for the 3-point seat belt and voluntarily gave it up. Being able to say "well on second thought, this invention is just so good we actually want to give it away" would be a chilling effect on exactly the inventions we want - those with overwhelming positive societal influence.