5 ms·

> One of the more interesting comments in the article is in regards to the social stigma of only consuming water during meals - people who have quit alcohol for

by pdog 9y ago

> One of the more interesting comments in the article is in regards to the social stigma of only consuming water during meals - people who have quit alcohol for various reasons have faced the same stigma when going out with friends. That stigma is entirely self-perception. No one cares or even notices what anyone else drinking.

jessriedel 9y ago
This is definitely false. I've had multiple women tell me the dominant thing they noticed on a first date was that I didn't order a drink. Likewise, many people can attest that the social encouragement to get everyone drinking in group situations is very explicit. Shared consumption of intoxicating substances is closely monitored by everyone in the group, and is not same thing as the true fact that no one cares whether you have a brown or black belt.
- exhilaration 9y ago
  I overheard one of my male co-workers telling a female co-worker that he doesn't drink. Her reaction was a literal "eww". That's when I learned that - much like smokers - drinkers were a tribe.
  - seanp2k2 9y ago
    Were? Smoking isn't very cool anymore, but drinking is still pretty cool. It's losing popularity in some circles, but in pop culture, rappers are still in the club ordering bottles, and not of Voss. Weed has a big chance to shake up the alcohol industry, because you can smoke like a Cummins 12-valve until you pass out, then feel fine the next morning. You also don't die if you have too much to smoke. It does have to do some work to get out of the goofy / high schooler / college bro image, but I think they can make it classy (esp stuff like vape pens...the whole blow torch + dabber + water pipe thing has pretty limited appeal because it's too involved and conspicuous). Coming soon to a state near you.
    - dagw 9y ago
      make it classy (esp stuff like vape pens I don't know. It feels like vape pens is one of the least classy things going on at the moment. I think the only thing that can make "weed" acceptable and "classy" is some variation on fancy edibles (or perhaps drinkables to bring the discussion full circle)
    - sulam 9y ago
      I am suspicious that smoking pot is just as bad for your lungs as smoking tobacco and we simply don't have decades of evidence yet. It stands to reason that inhaling burnt organics is going to have many of the same effects regardless of which plant is involved.
      - enobrev 9y ago
        That's likely true, although with legalization has come the popularity of - and even preference to - vape pens and edibles, which weren't as accessible.
- flashman 9y ago
  Not only that, some people leap to the conclusion that you don't drink because you're an alcoholic, and from there to the judgement that you're unreliable and untrustworthy. (Not that being an alcoholic makes you those things - but that's their perception learned from our culture.) Another unhealthy thing about drinking culture is how it stigmatises teetotallers as some moralising oppressers (thanks Prohibition), when they might just not want to feel like shit in the morning.
  - pluma 9y ago
    There are plenty of reasons not to drink, though. Maybe you're driving. Maybe you're on medication. Maybe if you're a woman you're trying to get pregnant (or already are). Either this "if you don't drink you must be an alcoholic" thing is entirely American or lots of people on HN hang around with the wrong crowd. EDIT: Also being "on call" is a good reason not to drink. Though if you need an excuse every time you go out with your friends, you deserve better friends.
    - Mtinie 9y ago
      Could be. The San Francisco drinking culture is pretty aggressive, but then again, so is NYC's, Lisbon's, Sydney's, or Shanghai's.
      - pluma 9y ago
        I'm in rural Germany. For 20-somethings it's perfectly normal to have designated drivers who don't drink, no questions asked. If you're a woman, most people will suspect you're pregnant but it's too early to be socially acceptable to ask you about it.
        Mtinie 9y ago
        Transportation plays a larger role in determining "tolerance" for how socially acceptable that is. Urban environments, with their preponderance of cars for hire reduces the need for designated drivers. I live in a suburban area in the U.S. and what you report is similar to what I've experienced, too. It could also be that my social circle is older, and many of us are parents, so it's not as convenient to go out for a hard night's drinking.
- Turing_Machine 9y ago
  > Shared consumption of intoxicating substances is closely monitored by everyone in the group Get better friends.
- pmarreck 9y ago
  Once upon a first date, I ordered a Manhattan and finished it, she ordered a wine and took 3 sips of it... I knew it wasn't going to work lol that said, some women become terrible (in more bad ways than good) when they get tipsy... including my current
kerkeslager 9y ago
This isn't true. People frequently notice that I'm not drinking and comment on it.
appleflaxen 9y ago
sometimes i drink; sometimes i don't. when i don't, somebody will notice and comment about 90% of the time.
NegativeK 9y ago
> No one cares or even notices what anyone else drinking. Some care, but that's usually easy for me to get away from. They usually notice, and they usually go through the standard comments on it.
wyclif 9y ago
Unless, that is, you're dining out. I do drink occasional alcoholic beverages but the last time I was out to dinner with my family and the waitress asked if we'd be interested in drinks and I declined while asking for an additional water, she gave me a not-quite-concealed eye roll. The message was loud and clear: she wasn't going to make much off my table. I can hardly blame her. Tips are how waitstaff make money, and if you order drinks the check is going to be a lot bigger. This is also why some people say weird things like you're "cheap" if you don't order drinks (especially if you are paying).

by pdog 9y ago

jessriedel 9y ago

This is definitely false. I've had multiple women tell me the dominant thing they noticed on a first date was that I didn't order a drink. Likewise, many people can attest that the social encouragement to get everyone drinking in group situations is very explicit. Shared consumption of intoxicating substances is closely monitored by everyone in the group, and is not same thing as the true fact that no one cares whether you have a brown or black belt.

exhilaration 9y ago
I overheard one of my male co-workers telling a female co-worker that he doesn't drink. Her reaction was a literal "eww". That's when I learned that - much like smokers - drinkers were a tribe.
- seanp2k2 9y ago
  Were? Smoking isn't very cool anymore, but drinking is still pretty cool. It's losing popularity in some circles, but in pop culture, rappers are still in the club ordering bottles, and not of Voss. Weed has a big chance to shake up the alcohol industry, because you can smoke like a Cummins 12-valve until you pass out, then feel fine the next morning. You also don't die if you have too much to smoke. It does have to do some work to get out of the goofy / high schooler / college bro image, but I think they can make it classy (esp stuff like vape pens...the whole blow torch + dabber + water pipe thing has pretty limited appeal because it's too involved and conspicuous). Coming soon to a state near you.
  - dagw 9y ago
    make it classy (esp stuff like vape pens I don't know. It feels like vape pens is one of the least classy things going on at the moment. I think the only thing that can make "weed" acceptable and "classy" is some variation on fancy edibles (or perhaps drinkables to bring the discussion full circle)
  - sulam 9y ago
    I am suspicious that smoking pot is just as bad for your lungs as smoking tobacco and we simply don't have decades of evidence yet. It stands to reason that inhaling burnt organics is going to have many of the same effects regardless of which plant is involved.
    - enobrev 9y ago
      That's likely true, although with legalization has come the popularity of - and even preference to - vape pens and edibles, which weren't as accessible.
flashman 9y ago
Not only that, some people leap to the conclusion that you don't drink because you're an alcoholic, and from there to the judgement that you're unreliable and untrustworthy. (Not that being an alcoholic makes you those things - but that's their perception learned from our culture.) Another unhealthy thing about drinking culture is how it stigmatises teetotallers as some moralising oppressers (thanks Prohibition), when they might just not want to feel like shit in the morning.
- pluma 9y ago
  There are plenty of reasons not to drink, though. Maybe you're driving. Maybe you're on medication. Maybe if you're a woman you're trying to get pregnant (or already are). Either this "if you don't drink you must be an alcoholic" thing is entirely American or lots of people on HN hang around with the wrong crowd. EDIT: Also being "on call" is a good reason not to drink. Though if you need an excuse every time you go out with your friends, you deserve better friends.
  - Mtinie 9y ago
    Could be. The San Francisco drinking culture is pretty aggressive, but then again, so is NYC's, Lisbon's, Sydney's, or Shanghai's.
    - pluma 9y ago
      I'm in rural Germany. For 20-somethings it's perfectly normal to have designated drivers who don't drink, no questions asked. If you're a woman, most people will suspect you're pregnant but it's too early to be socially acceptable to ask you about it.
      - Mtinie 9y ago
        Transportation plays a larger role in determining "tolerance" for how socially acceptable that is. Urban environments, with their preponderance of cars for hire reduces the need for designated drivers. I live in a suburban area in the U.S. and what you report is similar to what I've experienced, too. It could also be that my social circle is older, and many of us are parents, so it's not as convenient to go out for a hard night's drinking.
Turing_Machine 9y ago
> Shared consumption of intoxicating substances is closely monitored by everyone in the group Get better friends.
pmarreck 9y ago
Once upon a first date, I ordered a Manhattan and finished it, she ordered a wine and took 3 sips of it... I knew it wasn't going to work lol that said, some women become terrible (in more bad ways than good) when they get tipsy... including my current

kerkeslager 9y ago

This isn't true. People frequently notice that I'm not drinking and comment on it.

appleflaxen 9y ago

sometimes i drink; sometimes i don't. when i don't, somebody will notice and comment about 90% of the time.

NegativeK 9y ago

> No one cares or even notices what anyone else drinking. Some care, but that's usually easy for me to get away from. They usually notice, and they usually go through the standard comments on it.

wyclif 9y ago

Unless, that is, you're dining out. I do drink occasional alcoholic beverages but the last time I was out to dinner with my family and the waitress asked if we'd be interested in drinks and I declined while asking for an additional water, she gave me a not-quite-concealed eye roll. The message was loud and clear: she wasn't going to make much off my table. I can hardly blame her. Tips are how waitstaff make money, and if you order drinks the check is going to be a lot bigger. This is also why some people say weird things like you're "cheap" if you don't order drinks (especially if you are paying).