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It's probably because of the Age of Enlightenment in the west that did a thorough self evaluation over a few centuries. That type of self evaluation is rare in

It's probably because of the Age of Enlightenment in the west that did a thorough self evaluation over a few centuries. That type of self evaluation is rare in other cultures. As someone from the middle East (with a high chance of having Mongol blood), it does annoy me how much people are enamoured by Genghis khan. The guy was a brutal imperialist.

e59d134d 9y ago
Hypocrisy is amazing in most of the world. I was international student and met many at my university. It was mind boggling how almost everyone would celebrate their cultures' conquests & wars and at the same time call Western conquests evil and the worst thing. It was also amazing how most of the Western students would agree that Western imperialism was horrible but never argue against glorification of other cultures horrible wars.
- sumedh 9y ago
  I guess it's because of the timescales. I am assuming the people who celebrate the wars of kings in their lands are more than 500 years old while Western colonialism sort of stopped just 50-100 years back. So the Western atrocities are still fresh in the mind while people forget the 1000 year old atrocities.
  - roywiggins 9y ago
    For example, the crimes of the British during the Mau Mau rebellion are within living memory. And, importantly, the current British government is a successor to the one that oversaw those crimes.
    - vidarh 9y ago
      And conversely several African states have governments that either took part in the fight against colonialism personally, or are from families where family members fought the colonial powers. E.g. when looking at Robert Mugabe's hostility towards Britain in particular (without wanting to justify his authoritarianism and violence) it is worth considering that he fought for independence, and though Britain as responsible for allowing Rhodesia to happen.
  - e59d134d 9y ago
    I guess this does make sense. I wish people stop glorifying violence distance past, recent past or present.
- rbg246 9y ago
  What Western conquests were seen as evil out of interest? You mean colonisation? Or other wars?
  - e59d134d 9y ago
    Colonizations, almost all of my friends from international communities had their countries colonized by Western powers. A lot of them still blame colonization for current problems in their countries.
  - vidarh 9y ago
    To take a particularly bad one that relatively frequently comes up, consider the Congo Free State [1], which is considered bad enough by some still that a statue showing king Leopold II being celebrated by the Congolese was vandalised by someone chopping off the hand of one of the African characters to symbolise the history of chopping off the hands of those who refused to work the rubber plantations. But the list is massive. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congo_Free_State https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congo_Free_State
- freischwimmer 9y ago
  Was horrible? Are you forgetting about modern western imperialist adventures such as Iraq and Afghanistan, entering their 16th year? Where millions of civilians were and are still being killed, injured, displaced, tortured and all around stomped on in terms of human rights, led by some of the most powerful western nations in the world. These wars were cheered on by a good chunk of US and UK citizenry for years before they conveniently faded into the background. http://www.psr.org/assets/pdfs/body-count.pdf http://www.psr.org/assets/pdfs/body-count.pdf That's even ignoring the direct relations of these invasions to the more recent conflicts in Libya, Syria, and ISIS, the boogeymen armed and created by the same people who started these wars not long ago. Western imperialism is alive and well.
  - valuearb 9y ago
    Pretty sure Afghanistan attacked the U.S. first. And that western nations are supporting freedom fighters in Syria.
davidreiss 9y ago
> That type of self evaluation is rare in other cultures. It is rare everywhere. Even in the west. We celebrate george washington and have statues, schools, etc named after racist slavers and genocidal murderers. > It was also amazing how most of the Western students would agree that Western imperialism was horrible but never argue against glorification of other cultures horrible wars. Really? You think most of us think western imperialism was horrible? We may give lip service to it, but we celebrate our heritage. From ancient greece to rome to the british empire to now our american empire, we celebrate our conquests and victories. The standard trope amongst the british is that the british empire brought civilization and democracy to most of the world. Our justification for the american empire is that we bring "freedom" to the world.
jimmyk 9y ago
>It's probably because of the Age of Enlightenment in the west that did a thorough self evaluation over a few centuries. I'm not sure what a "thorough self evaluation" would actually mean. I don't think that's even remotely feasible, given the immense scope of the subject matter. What has happened is that certain elements within western civilization have focused their efforts on criticizing western civilization, some in good faith and some not, and the rest of western civilization has allowed them to do so. That is the part that is rare, just like suicide, and for the same reason.

e59d134d 9y ago

Hypocrisy is amazing in most of the world. I was international student and met many at my university. It was mind boggling how almost everyone would celebrate their cultures' conquests & wars and at the same time call Western conquests evil and the worst thing. It was also amazing how most of the Western students would agree that Western imperialism was horrible but never argue against glorification of other cultures horrible wars.

sumedh 9y ago
I guess it's because of the timescales. I am assuming the people who celebrate the wars of kings in their lands are more than 500 years old while Western colonialism sort of stopped just 50-100 years back. So the Western atrocities are still fresh in the mind while people forget the 1000 year old atrocities.
- roywiggins 9y ago
  For example, the crimes of the British during the Mau Mau rebellion are within living memory. And, importantly, the current British government is a successor to the one that oversaw those crimes.
  - vidarh 9y ago
    And conversely several African states have governments that either took part in the fight against colonialism personally, or are from families where family members fought the colonial powers. E.g. when looking at Robert Mugabe's hostility towards Britain in particular (without wanting to justify his authoritarianism and violence) it is worth considering that he fought for independence, and though Britain as responsible for allowing Rhodesia to happen.
- e59d134d 9y ago
  I guess this does make sense. I wish people stop glorifying violence distance past, recent past or present.
rbg246 9y ago
What Western conquests were seen as evil out of interest? You mean colonisation? Or other wars?
- e59d134d 9y ago
  Colonizations, almost all of my friends from international communities had their countries colonized by Western powers. A lot of them still blame colonization for current problems in their countries.
- vidarh 9y ago
  To take a particularly bad one that relatively frequently comes up, consider the Congo Free State [1], which is considered bad enough by some still that a statue showing king Leopold II being celebrated by the Congolese was vandalised by someone chopping off the hand of one of the African characters to symbolise the history of chopping off the hands of those who refused to work the rubber plantations. But the list is massive. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congo_Free_State https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congo_Free_State
freischwimmer 9y ago
Was horrible? Are you forgetting about modern western imperialist adventures such as Iraq and Afghanistan, entering their 16th year? Where millions of civilians were and are still being killed, injured, displaced, tortured and all around stomped on in terms of human rights, led by some of the most powerful western nations in the world. These wars were cheered on by a good chunk of US and UK citizenry for years before they conveniently faded into the background. http://www.psr.org/assets/pdfs/body-count.pdf http://www.psr.org/assets/pdfs/body-count.pdf That's even ignoring the direct relations of these invasions to the more recent conflicts in Libya, Syria, and ISIS, the boogeymen armed and created by the same people who started these wars not long ago. Western imperialism is alive and well.
- valuearb 9y ago
  Pretty sure Afghanistan attacked the U.S. first. And that western nations are supporting freedom fighters in Syria.

davidreiss 9y ago

> That type of self evaluation is rare in other cultures. It is rare everywhere. Even in the west. We celebrate george washington and have statues, schools, etc named after racist slavers and genocidal murderers. > It was also amazing how most of the Western students would agree that Western imperialism was horrible but never argue against glorification of other cultures horrible wars. Really? You think most of us think western imperialism was horrible? We may give lip service to it, but we celebrate our heritage. From ancient greece to rome to the british empire to now our american empire, we celebrate our conquests and victories. The standard trope amongst the british is that the british empire brought civilization and democracy to most of the world. Our justification for the american empire is that we bring "freedom" to the world.

jimmyk 9y ago

>It's probably because of the Age of Enlightenment in the west that did a thorough self evaluation over a few centuries. I'm not sure what a "thorough self evaluation" would actually mean. I don't think that's even remotely feasible, given the immense scope of the subject matter. What has happened is that certain elements within western civilization have focused their efforts on criticizing western civilization, some in good faith and some not, and the rest of western civilization has allowed them to do so. That is the part that is rare, just like suicide, and for the same reason.