4 ms·

This is a starry-eyed blog post. I like it, and I miss not having more of these. We need more starry-eyed dreamers because they get good things done. I just sp

This is a starry-eyed blog post. I like it, and I miss not having more of these. We need more starry-eyed dreamers because they get good things done. I just spent some time with the Debian crew at the last Debconf here in Mtl. I've always liked their attitude and I love their operating system -- and so does everyone else who has ever created a Debian derivative. Others at Debconf felt the same. Bradley Kuhn even said something like what a breath of fresh air it was to not have to apologise for being a free software supporter. I love how organic Debian is and how the conference was perfectly run with livestreaming and IRC bots keeping us abreast of the next event. These polychromatically-haired dreamers know how to get things done. So, it's good to see that the starry-eyed blog posts haven't stopped.

fny 9y ago
Why would someone have to apologize for being a free software supporter? I consider my FSF membership a point of pride.
- jordigh 9y ago
  We get told many things. That we are fundamentalists, that all software cannot or should not be free, that the GPL is too restrictive, that we are anti-business, that we spend more time arguing politics than getting things done, that we are passé because Apple and Microsoft are releasing some free software. Someone like bkuhn gets to hear things like that all the time. It's nice for a change to not have to argue against each of those points.
- b4ux1t3 9y ago
  I'm all for free software. Really, I am. I just have a problem with the idea that free software is absolutely the only way to go. I have no problem with people who refuse to run non-free software. I have a problem when they insist that I'm doing it wrong by running Windows. Sent from my Fedora-running laptop.
  - jordigh 9y ago
    I don't think you're doing anyone any harm by running Windows. I just wish you didn't have to.
    - b4ux1t3 9y ago
      See, that's an enlightened way of looking at it. In the end, until Open Source gets as much funding as proprietary software, it's not going to have anywhere near the level of direct support that things like Windows get. Say what you will about Windows (And OS X), but, for the most part, it just works, out of the box. Compare that to my experience trying to get Fedora to run on a late-model HP laptop, and you see why people prefer something that just works. (Keeping in mind that I've been putting Linux on things for the past 15 years or so). But that's the key: Getting Open Source funded. And that's where being "FOSS OR NOTHING" hinders FOSS, because if people don't know how to support something, and don't see any value, and are confronted by a mob of angry FOSS advocates bashing on the things those people have been using for most of their lives, they're going to back away slowly, back to their proprietary safe space, where no one is yelling at them that what they're doing is an affront to freedom. As long as there are people like RMS who actively show disdain for proprietary software and those who use it, people are going to be turned off of FOSS. Which is a shame, in my book.
      - throwaway08320 9y ago
        > mob of angry FOSS advocates I've been at DebConfs, FOSDEMs and other events and never met any these angry advocates. They seem to be mailing list / twitter trolls. > people like RMS who actively show disdain for proprietary software and those who use it Do you have sources to support the claim that RMS shows disdain for people using proprietary software?
        b4ux1t3 9y ago
        Point 1: I take it you've never been on the receiving end of the "Oh, you use _Windoze_" comments. The fact that "M$ Windoze" exists as a meme is proof enough that there are enough people who show disdain for proprietary software that people took notice. Point 2: Do you mean besides his every day demeanor? Or besides his extensive essays on the evils of proprietary software that imply _strongly_ that people who use and create them are against Freedom? Look, the vast, silent majority, as with most groups, doesn't care what kind of software other people use. The problem is, as usual, the core, vocal group of people who dislike anyone who doesn't think like they do.

fny 9y ago

Why would someone have to apologize for being a free software supporter? I consider my FSF membership a point of pride.

jordigh 9y ago
We get told many things. That we are fundamentalists, that all software cannot or should not be free, that the GPL is too restrictive, that we are anti-business, that we spend more time arguing politics than getting things done, that we are passé because Apple and Microsoft are releasing some free software. Someone like bkuhn gets to hear things like that all the time. It's nice for a change to not have to argue against each of those points.
b4ux1t3 9y ago
I'm all for free software. Really, I am. I just have a problem with the idea that free software is absolutely the only way to go. I have no problem with people who refuse to run non-free software. I have a problem when they insist that I'm doing it wrong by running Windows. Sent from my Fedora-running laptop.
- jordigh 9y ago
  I don't think you're doing anyone any harm by running Windows. I just wish you didn't have to.
  - b4ux1t3 9y ago
    See, that's an enlightened way of looking at it. In the end, until Open Source gets as much funding as proprietary software, it's not going to have anywhere near the level of direct support that things like Windows get. Say what you will about Windows (And OS X), but, for the most part, it just works, out of the box. Compare that to my experience trying to get Fedora to run on a late-model HP laptop, and you see why people prefer something that just works. (Keeping in mind that I've been putting Linux on things for the past 15 years or so). But that's the key: Getting Open Source funded. And that's where being "FOSS OR NOTHING" hinders FOSS, because if people don't know how to support something, and don't see any value, and are confronted by a mob of angry FOSS advocates bashing on the things those people have been using for most of their lives, they're going to back away slowly, back to their proprietary safe space, where no one is yelling at them that what they're doing is an affront to freedom. As long as there are people like RMS who actively show disdain for proprietary software and those who use it, people are going to be turned off of FOSS. Which is a shame, in my book.
    - throwaway08320 9y ago
      > mob of angry FOSS advocates I've been at DebConfs, FOSDEMs and other events and never met any these angry advocates. They seem to be mailing list / twitter trolls. > people like RMS who actively show disdain for proprietary software and those who use it Do you have sources to support the claim that RMS shows disdain for people using proprietary software?
      - b4ux1t3 9y ago
        Point 1: I take it you've never been on the receiving end of the "Oh, you use _Windoze_" comments. The fact that "M$ Windoze" exists as a meme is proof enough that there are enough people who show disdain for proprietary software that people took notice. Point 2: Do you mean besides his every day demeanor? Or besides his extensive essays on the evils of proprietary software that imply _strongly_ that people who use and create them are against Freedom? Look, the vast, silent majority, as with most groups, doesn't care what kind of software other people use. The problem is, as usual, the core, vocal group of people who dislike anyone who doesn't think like they do.