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There aren't any gatekeepers. There are people are doing work for you. You are totally in control. You (or your org) can opt to have some of that work done for

by gaius 9y ago

There aren't any gatekeepers. There are people are doing work for you. You are totally in control. You (or your org) can opt to have some of that work done for you. You can't pretend that it doesn't need to be done at all Soon are coming the days in which developers produce Docker images as their primary artefact and Ops are responsible just for k8s, DC/OS or whatever runs them, without knowing or needing to know what's inside those containers. At first developers will be ecstatic, they can use any version of anything, never have to get anyone else to install anything first, brilliant! Then the 3am phone calls will start...

eikenberry 9y ago
> Then the 3am phone calls will start... As a developer this is exactly what I want. It is part of having ownership and is critical to writing and maintaining good software. Containers are great for this reason as they give me control of the complete runtime environment of my application so I can better support it. And it makes those 3am calls less frequent, not more. I've always been on call for my software and I thought this was now the norm and the throw-it-over-the-wall process had mostly died out.
- gaius 9y ago
  As a developer this is exactly what I want That's refreshing to hear. I've done both jobs, and I'll tell you what I've observed: if you were to go over to a developer and say "there's a bug in the program" they would look at you as if you were an idiot. What program? And when you do what? But that same developer will go to ops and say "the server is slow", seemingly entirely unaware that the person they are talking to supports hundreds of apps running across thousands of servers. I think many developers are in for a bit of a surprise when they discover DevOps means "you do ops too now".
majewsky 9y ago
You're saying this as if it hadn't already happened.

by gaius 9y ago

eikenberry 9y ago

> Then the 3am phone calls will start... As a developer this is exactly what I want. It is part of having ownership and is critical to writing and maintaining good software. Containers are great for this reason as they give me control of the complete runtime environment of my application so I can better support it. And it makes those 3am calls less frequent, not more. I've always been on call for my software and I thought this was now the norm and the throw-it-over-the-wall process had mostly died out.

gaius 9y ago
As a developer this is exactly what I want That's refreshing to hear. I've done both jobs, and I'll tell you what I've observed: if you were to go over to a developer and say "there's a bug in the program" they would look at you as if you were an idiot. What program? And when you do what? But that same developer will go to ops and say "the server is slow", seemingly entirely unaware that the person they are talking to supports hundreds of apps running across thousands of servers. I think many developers are in for a bit of a surprise when they discover DevOps means "you do ops too now".

majewsky 9y ago

You're saying this as if it hadn't already happened.