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> and would like to meet every injured person as soon as they are well It's 'caring theater'. He thinks he is the President meeting with people getting the pu

by gist 9y ago

> and would like to meet every injured person as soon as they are well It's 'caring theater'. He thinks he is the President meeting with people getting the purple heart for service. Such utter bullshit. [1] [2] [1] The fact that he says he wants to be personally involved in the process is what puts it over the edge. I mean he is running how many companies? [2] And to front run any legal or PR issues. Create an emotional block for the harmed to take things a step further. "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer".

manmal 9y ago
I'm quite sure he is doing internal PR, keeping up the team morale. It's not so much about caring (aka patronizing), but more about giving workers the feeling that they are all rolling up their sleeves together. IMO it's the only strategy that keeps teams together in times of high stress. People become very sensitive to "boss issues" if the work or workload sucks. To prevent burnout, workers have to feel that they are cared for, and their work appreciated. I'm sure you were in such a high stress situation yourself before - if team spirit stays intact, you feel strong and maybe even euphoric. As soon as things go downhill, you will soon think of bailing out.
- emodendroket 9y ago
  One way of making workers feel unappreciated is to run your factory in such a way that more of them are injured than in similar facilities run by your competitors.
- gist 9y ago
  > but more about giving workers the feeling that they are all rolling up their sleeves together Sure and maybe to show his appreciation he will invite all of them to use some of the great things that he gains or has that they don't (material or otherwise) for the herculean effort. They aren't all created equal and his equal we all know that. Would think especially the factory workers on the floor. And I am a owner and not a worker. So this isn't about the downtrodden or me feeling abused in a similar situation. Hasn't happened. It's about being realistic and quite frankly in all honesty jealousy of someone that can flip such stuff which I was never able to do even if it would benefit me. Couldn't be that dishonest. Not saying that it isn't an effective technique (your point). It is.
- maxerickson 9y ago
  Yes of course it is PR. The thing people are wondering about is whether it is disingenuous bullshit PR.
gordon_freeman 9y ago
Please look past the reasons you have described. What Elon is saying is that he will personally meet the injured workers and hear from them what happened with the process and why the injury happened. Then he'd go back to the process by performing it himself and find the root cause. He will then make sure that these processes are improved so no such incidents happen again. I read similar stuff in The Toyota Way book where workers kept complaining to the management about poor manufacturing processes leading to the injury and poor quality incidents and then the management made sure these processes are constantly improved (Kaizen).
- gist 9y ago
  > Then he'd go back to the process by performing it himself and find the root cause. Right. That is what I am calling out. The fact that he will do this is ludicrous and certainly not anywhere near the best use of his time. We are not talking about a small mom and pop or lean startup with limited resources. > and then the management made sure these processes The CEO of Toyota? Almost certainly not. Undercover boss type things or spending a few hours in a call center or store or anywhere to get a seat of the pants feel for things? Sure.
  - hwillis 9y ago
    In both Tesla and SpaceX it's part of the culture that safety worries are elevated to very high levels very quickly. There was one guy (vet, nontechnical something or other) in SpaceX who was fired for abusing this, but what struck me most about the story was how he was in repeated contact with the technical person directly under Musk before he went directly to Musk himself. It seemed like that had all been fine, and he was only fired after refusing to let it go with Musk (plus IIRC he was basically out of his depth with the issue). Musk is ultraproductive and works very closely with his employees. Tesla only has two factories; it's on a much more manageable scale than something like Toyota.
rustynails 9y ago
And what would you have him do? Let's assume for a moment, he's telling the truth. He's tried to improve assembly process. He's asked to personally be in the loop. He's said he'll do the task himself to make an assessment. Alternatively, if he lies, that's another matter. He has made a commitment and he can be measured against that. Don't get me wrong. Nobody is so naive to believe everybody's perfect. However, I'll give Musk the benefit of the doubt and watch closely. We need to move back to a philosophy of objective fact, unambiguous statement of intent, being measured against that intent. If you have value to add, please do. However, throwing Machiavellian observations into the ring is unlikely to provide value unless something was missing from the article or you can tie it to an objective fact.

by gist 9y ago

manmal 9y ago

I'm quite sure he is doing internal PR, keeping up the team morale. It's not so much about caring (aka patronizing), but more about giving workers the feeling that they are all rolling up their sleeves together. IMO it's the only strategy that keeps teams together in times of high stress. People become very sensitive to "boss issues" if the work or workload sucks. To prevent burnout, workers have to feel that they are cared for, and their work appreciated. I'm sure you were in such a high stress situation yourself before - if team spirit stays intact, you feel strong and maybe even euphoric. As soon as things go downhill, you will soon think of bailing out.

emodendroket 9y ago
One way of making workers feel unappreciated is to run your factory in such a way that more of them are injured than in similar facilities run by your competitors.
gist 9y ago
> but more about giving workers the feeling that they are all rolling up their sleeves together Sure and maybe to show his appreciation he will invite all of them to use some of the great things that he gains or has that they don't (material or otherwise) for the herculean effort. They aren't all created equal and his equal we all know that. Would think especially the factory workers on the floor. And I am a owner and not a worker. So this isn't about the downtrodden or me feeling abused in a similar situation. Hasn't happened. It's about being realistic and quite frankly in all honesty jealousy of someone that can flip such stuff which I was never able to do even if it would benefit me. Couldn't be that dishonest. Not saying that it isn't an effective technique (your point). It is.
maxerickson 9y ago
Yes of course it is PR. The thing people are wondering about is whether it is disingenuous bullshit PR.

gordon_freeman 9y ago

Please look past the reasons you have described. What Elon is saying is that he will personally meet the injured workers and hear from them what happened with the process and why the injury happened. Then he'd go back to the process by performing it himself and find the root cause. He will then make sure that these processes are improved so no such incidents happen again. I read similar stuff in The Toyota Way book where workers kept complaining to the management about poor manufacturing processes leading to the injury and poor quality incidents and then the management made sure these processes are constantly improved (Kaizen).

gist 9y ago
> Then he'd go back to the process by performing it himself and find the root cause. Right. That is what I am calling out. The fact that he will do this is ludicrous and certainly not anywhere near the best use of his time. We are not talking about a small mom and pop or lean startup with limited resources. > and then the management made sure these processes The CEO of Toyota? Almost certainly not. Undercover boss type things or spending a few hours in a call center or store or anywhere to get a seat of the pants feel for things? Sure.
- hwillis 9y ago
  In both Tesla and SpaceX it's part of the culture that safety worries are elevated to very high levels very quickly. There was one guy (vet, nontechnical something or other) in SpaceX who was fired for abusing this, but what struck me most about the story was how he was in repeated contact with the technical person directly under Musk before he went directly to Musk himself. It seemed like that had all been fine, and he was only fired after refusing to let it go with Musk (plus IIRC he was basically out of his depth with the issue). Musk is ultraproductive and works very closely with his employees. Tesla only has two factories; it's on a much more manageable scale than something like Toyota.

rustynails 9y ago

And what would you have him do? Let's assume for a moment, he's telling the truth. He's tried to improve assembly process. He's asked to personally be in the loop. He's said he'll do the task himself to make an assessment. Alternatively, if he lies, that's another matter. He has made a commitment and he can be measured against that. Don't get me wrong. Nobody is so naive to believe everybody's perfect. However, I'll give Musk the benefit of the doubt and watch closely. We need to move back to a philosophy of objective fact, unambiguous statement of intent, being measured against that intent. If you have value to add, please do. However, throwing Machiavellian observations into the ring is unlikely to provide value unless something was missing from the article or you can tie it to an objective fact.