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I think this is the problem: Google is a particularly intense echo chamber because it is in the middle of Silicon Valley and is so life-encompassing as a place

I think this is the problem: Google is a particularly intense echo chamber because it is in the middle of Silicon Valley and is so life-encompassing as a place to work. With free food, internal meme boards and weekly companywide meetings, Google becomes a huge part of its employees’ lives. Some even live on campus. For many, including myself, working at Google is a major part of their identity, almost like a cult with its own leaders and saints, all believed to righteously uphold the sacred motto of “Don’t be evil.” Google may ingratiate itself into all these parts of your life but really it only wants one thing: your work. Damore fell into the illusion that Google really was a way of life, that they ever really cared about a political debate. They don't. It's just a company. Keep your political opinions out of the workplace.

alexandercrohde 9y ago
I think the inconsistency I see, is that those who wrote letters of complaint about him did so out of a political agenda. I see this argument being used unilaterally. You could just as easily say to those offended "Don't read things you are offended by. Shame on you for reading political stuff at work, keep it out of here." [Seeing the tone of this thread I expect to lose a lot of karma for this, but it's just imaginary internet points]
- frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
  >I think the inconsistency I see, is that those who wrote letters of complaint about him did so out of a political agenda. You mean those outside of the company like on twitter and stuff? Sure I agree, but they're not bringing it up at their workplace. The people working at google who have complained I think is actually reasonable. Damore brought this issue into the workplace. When somebody brings an issue like that in, your solution is that everybody should ignore it? It has to be addressed at that point. Really I'd say if you go to your job and you bring outside political issues into your workplace you're creating a messy problem because you're piercing the work-veil so to speak.
  - alexandercrohde 9y ago
    Does it have to be addressed? It went largely ignored for months. I suspect the reason this went viral was the offended parties recirculated it amongst themselves. If the explosion is the problem, consider the gunpowder, as well as the spark.
    - frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
      >Does it have to be addressed? Yes. >It went largely ignored for months. I suspect the reason this went viral was the offended parties recirculated it amongst themselves. But we don't know how widely circulated it was during those months, in fact we don't really know anything about it's release. It seems to me that it was circulated among what was probably a small group who agreed with damore (a boys club if you will :P) and then broke out of that group, other people started reading it and all hell broke loose. The fact that no one discovered it for months doesn't really change anything about the memo or its contents. >If the explosion is the problem, consider the gunpowder, as well as the spark. I do consider both. Damore wrote the memo (gunpowder) then released it at his workplace (the spark.)
      - alexandercrohde 9y ago
        Or maybe there is a large community of very angry people who identify as victims (gunpowder) and this particular piece was the spark. Maybe it's just a matter of time until this same group gets offended by another controversial political opinion held/shared by a coworker.
        frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
        Or maybe there is a large community of very angry people who identify as victims (gunpowder) and this particular firing was the spark. It's not a useful distinction. By the same argument all the people upset about his firing should stop reading the news about it and get on with their day. All these valley programmers who lean right politically do seem quite eager to play the victim after all, really they're out looking for something to set them off like Damore's firing aren't they? They obviously have a political agenda don't they? They're recirculating news about damore's firing amongst themselves aren't they? It's inane, the problem has a defined source: Damore bringing his political opinion into the workplace.
- rhizome 9y ago
  You could just as easily say to those offended "Don't read things you are offended by This is victim-blaming and poor reasoning that has been used for decades by spammers and their ilk. The problem is that the offense is only discovered by the thing you're suggesting they don't do. This is a Catch 22. By the same logic, you'd advise a person in the Emergency Room, "don't stand in front a gun next time."
  - alexandercrohde 9y ago
    Who gets to decide who's the victim? How come I'm not allowed to have my own, equally-valid opinion about who's the victim? Doesn't seem fair to me. I think the victim is the person who I believe tried to express his views and was fired.
    - rhizome 9y ago
      Who said you're not allowed to have your own opinion? I was merely reacting to it...unless that's the part you have a problem with. Google reacted to his expression, which he offered without duress.

alexandercrohde 9y ago

I think the inconsistency I see, is that those who wrote letters of complaint about him did so out of a political agenda. I see this argument being used unilaterally. You could just as easily say to those offended "Don't read things you are offended by. Shame on you for reading political stuff at work, keep it out of here." [Seeing the tone of this thread I expect to lose a lot of karma for this, but it's just imaginary internet points]

frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
>I think the inconsistency I see, is that those who wrote letters of complaint about him did so out of a political agenda. You mean those outside of the company like on twitter and stuff? Sure I agree, but they're not bringing it up at their workplace. The people working at google who have complained I think is actually reasonable. Damore brought this issue into the workplace. When somebody brings an issue like that in, your solution is that everybody should ignore it? It has to be addressed at that point. Really I'd say if you go to your job and you bring outside political issues into your workplace you're creating a messy problem because you're piercing the work-veil so to speak.
- alexandercrohde 9y ago
  Does it have to be addressed? It went largely ignored for months. I suspect the reason this went viral was the offended parties recirculated it amongst themselves. If the explosion is the problem, consider the gunpowder, as well as the spark.
  - frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
    >Does it have to be addressed? Yes. >It went largely ignored for months. I suspect the reason this went viral was the offended parties recirculated it amongst themselves. But we don't know how widely circulated it was during those months, in fact we don't really know anything about it's release. It seems to me that it was circulated among what was probably a small group who agreed with damore (a boys club if you will :P) and then broke out of that group, other people started reading it and all hell broke loose. The fact that no one discovered it for months doesn't really change anything about the memo or its contents. >If the explosion is the problem, consider the gunpowder, as well as the spark. I do consider both. Damore wrote the memo (gunpowder) then released it at his workplace (the spark.)
    - alexandercrohde 9y ago
      Or maybe there is a large community of very angry people who identify as victims (gunpowder) and this particular piece was the spark. Maybe it's just a matter of time until this same group gets offended by another controversial political opinion held/shared by a coworker.
      - frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
        Or maybe there is a large community of very angry people who identify as victims (gunpowder) and this particular firing was the spark. It's not a useful distinction. By the same argument all the people upset about his firing should stop reading the news about it and get on with their day. All these valley programmers who lean right politically do seem quite eager to play the victim after all, really they're out looking for something to set them off like Damore's firing aren't they? They obviously have a political agenda don't they? They're recirculating news about damore's firing amongst themselves aren't they? It's inane, the problem has a defined source: Damore bringing his political opinion into the workplace.
rhizome 9y ago
You could just as easily say to those offended "Don't read things you are offended by This is victim-blaming and poor reasoning that has been used for decades by spammers and their ilk. The problem is that the offense is only discovered by the thing you're suggesting they don't do. This is a Catch 22. By the same logic, you'd advise a person in the Emergency Room, "don't stand in front a gun next time."
- alexandercrohde 9y ago
  Who gets to decide who's the victim? How come I'm not allowed to have my own, equally-valid opinion about who's the victim? Doesn't seem fair to me. I think the victim is the person who I believe tried to express his views and was fired.
  - rhizome 9y ago
    Who said you're not allowed to have your own opinion? I was merely reacting to it...unless that's the part you have a problem with. Google reacted to his expression, which he offered without duress.