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The Guardian publishes the opinion of people on the left and on the far left. Julie Bindel is about as far-left as possible. Every article they publish about s

The Guardian publishes the opinion of people on the left and on the far left. Julie Bindel is about as far-left as possible. Every article they publish about someone from the right is an attack. How is that centrist?

eesmith 9y ago
"center left" != centrist != far left. You claim The Guardian is far left. All you've demonstrated is that they are somewhere on the left, and I (and Wikipedia) claim they are center-left. Quoting again from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Guardian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Guardian: "Then Guardian features editor Ian Katz asserted in 2004 that "it is no secret we are a centre-left newspaper".[120] In 2008, Guardian columnist Jackie Ashley said that editorial contributors were a mix of "right-of-centre libertarians, greens, Blairites, Brownites, Labourite but less enthusiastic Brownites, etc," and that the newspaper was "clearly left of centre and vaguely progressive". She also said that "you can be absolutely certain that come the next general election, The Guardian's stance will not be dictated by the editor, still less any foreign proprietor (it helps that there isn't one) but will be the result of vigorous debate within the paper".[121] The paper's comment and opinion pages, though often written by centre-left contributors such as Polly Toynbee, have allowed some space for right-of-centre voices such as Sir Max Hastings and Michael Gove. " One of the opinion pieces by Gove is https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/29/hero-conservative-millionaire-saving-schools https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/29/hero-c... titled "My hero: Lord Harris, the Conservative millionaire who is saving schools". If it is an attack then it is an attack on the Labour Party. "Julie Bindel is about as far-left as possible". Are you really that oblivious as to what the real far-left looks like? Typically it applies to someone to the left of social democracy, like a Communist, Trotskyist, democratic socialist, or Maoist. While https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julie_Bindel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julie_Bindel describes her as: While focusing on male violence against women, Bindel also writes about gender inequality in general, as well as stalking, religious fundamentalism, lesbian rights, opposition to the sex industry and human trafficking.[8] She refers to herself as a political lesbian feminist. This is mainstream feminist left, not far-left. Jean-Luc Mélenchon is further to the left. Here are some of his policies, from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Luc_M%C3%A9lenchon#Political_positions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Luc_M%C3%A9lenchon#Politi...: He is a proponent of increased labour rights and the expansion of French welfare programmes.[33] Mélenchon has also called for the mass redistribution of wealth to rectify existing socioeconomic inequalities.[33] Domestic policies proposed by Mélenchon include a 100 per cent income tax on all French citizens earning more than 360,000 Euros a year, full state reimbursement for health care costs, a reduction in presidential powers in favour of the legislature, and the easing of immigration laws.[34] Mélenchon supports women's right to abortion and same-sex marriage. He also supports the legalisation of cannabis.[35] He founded La France Insoumise, a democratic socialist political party. He started as a member of the Internationalist Communist Organisation.
- leereeves 9y ago
  Julie Bindel is a trans-exclusionary radical feminist (TERF) https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/31/gender.weekend7 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/31/gender.weekend... who's opposed to jury trials in rape cases https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/12/juries-no-place-rape-trials-victims-deserve-unprejudiced-justice-judge https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/12/juries... and marriage https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/video/2016/may/25/women-face-it-marriage-can-never-be-feminist-video https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/video/2016/may/25/... That may not be the same far left as communism, but that is far left, not mainstream. Michael Gove only wrote 13 articles for The Guardian over 10 years. And I don't know why you thought pointing out that another Guardian opinion writer was a communist would help your case.
  - eesmith 9y ago
    Again, I fail to understand your point. How does this show that The Guardian is a far-left newspaper? The example from Gove was to point out that your statement that The Guardian "publishes the opinion of people on the left and on the far left" but not from the right is incorrect. Are you going to update all of the Wikipedia pages from "centre-right" to "far right"? Because it looks like to me that you have no idea of what "far left" really means. Perhaps you think that that anything to the left of the US Democratic Party is "far left"? Also, most of what you mentioned aren't on the left/right spectrum. There are many leftists who hold completely opposing views.
    - leereeves 9y ago
      This, like any argument about the meaning of left and right, is pointless. Nobody can clearly define what those terms mean anyway. Perhaps we can agree The Guardian is centre-left by UK standards and far-left by American standards.
      - eesmith 9y ago
        Like I ask, what Overton window are you looking through? Answer: the US one, where there's been 80 years of anti-communist, anti-socialist propaganda to turn "liberal" and "progressive" into slurs and to keep people from knowing what "the left" really means. The UK standard in this regard is shared with most of the rest of Europe and the European ex-colonies (South America, Australia, South Africa, etc.) It's the US which is the odd-one-out.

eesmith 9y ago

"center left" != centrist != far left. You claim The Guardian is far left. All you've demonstrated is that they are somewhere on the left, and I (and Wikipedia) claim they are center-left. Quoting again from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Guardian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Guardian: "Then Guardian features editor Ian Katz asserted in 2004 that "it is no secret we are a centre-left newspaper".[120] In 2008, Guardian columnist Jackie Ashley said that editorial contributors were a mix of "right-of-centre libertarians, greens, Blairites, Brownites, Labourite but less enthusiastic Brownites, etc," and that the newspaper was "clearly left of centre and vaguely progressive". She also said that "you can be absolutely certain that come the next general election, The Guardian's stance will not be dictated by the editor, still less any foreign proprietor (it helps that there isn't one) but will be the result of vigorous debate within the paper".[121] The paper's comment and opinion pages, though often written by centre-left contributors such as Polly Toynbee, have allowed some space for right-of-centre voices such as Sir Max Hastings and Michael Gove. " One of the opinion pieces by Gove is https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/29/hero-conservative-millionaire-saving-schools https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/29/hero-c... titled "My hero: Lord Harris, the Conservative millionaire who is saving schools". If it is an attack then it is an attack on the Labour Party. "Julie Bindel is about as far-left as possible". Are you really that oblivious as to what the real far-left looks like? Typically it applies to someone to the left of social democracy, like a Communist, Trotskyist, democratic socialist, or Maoist. While https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julie_Bindel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julie_Bindel describes her as: While focusing on male violence against women, Bindel also writes about gender inequality in general, as well as stalking, religious fundamentalism, lesbian rights, opposition to the sex industry and human trafficking.[8] She refers to herself as a political lesbian feminist. This is mainstream feminist left, not far-left. Jean-Luc Mélenchon is further to the left. Here are some of his policies, from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Luc_M%C3%A9lenchon#Political_positions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Luc_M%C3%A9lenchon#Politi...: He is a proponent of increased labour rights and the expansion of French welfare programmes.[33] Mélenchon has also called for the mass redistribution of wealth to rectify existing socioeconomic inequalities.[33] Domestic policies proposed by Mélenchon include a 100 per cent income tax on all French citizens earning more than 360,000 Euros a year, full state reimbursement for health care costs, a reduction in presidential powers in favour of the legislature, and the easing of immigration laws.[34] Mélenchon supports women's right to abortion and same-sex marriage. He also supports the legalisation of cannabis.[35] He founded La France Insoumise, a democratic socialist political party. He started as a member of the Internationalist Communist Organisation.

leereeves 9y ago
Julie Bindel is a trans-exclusionary radical feminist (TERF) https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/31/gender.weekend7 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/31/gender.weekend... who's opposed to jury trials in rape cases https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/12/juries-no-place-rape-trials-victims-deserve-unprejudiced-justice-judge https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/12/juries... and marriage https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/video/2016/may/25/women-face-it-marriage-can-never-be-feminist-video https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/video/2016/may/25/... That may not be the same far left as communism, but that is far left, not mainstream. Michael Gove only wrote 13 articles for The Guardian over 10 years. And I don't know why you thought pointing out that another Guardian opinion writer was a communist would help your case.
- eesmith 9y ago
  Again, I fail to understand your point. How does this show that The Guardian is a far-left newspaper? The example from Gove was to point out that your statement that The Guardian "publishes the opinion of people on the left and on the far left" but not from the right is incorrect. Are you going to update all of the Wikipedia pages from "centre-right" to "far right"? Because it looks like to me that you have no idea of what "far left" really means. Perhaps you think that that anything to the left of the US Democratic Party is "far left"? Also, most of what you mentioned aren't on the left/right spectrum. There are many leftists who hold completely opposing views.
  - leereeves 9y ago
    This, like any argument about the meaning of left and right, is pointless. Nobody can clearly define what those terms mean anyway. Perhaps we can agree The Guardian is centre-left by UK standards and far-left by American standards.
    - eesmith 9y ago
      Like I ask, what Overton window are you looking through? Answer: the US one, where there's been 80 years of anti-communist, anti-socialist propaganda to turn "liberal" and "progressive" into slurs and to keep people from knowing what "the left" really means. The UK standard in this regard is shared with most of the rest of Europe and the European ex-colonies (South America, Australia, South Africa, etc.) It's the US which is the odd-one-out.