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Curious if you feel Colin Kaepernick should have been fired and blacklisted for supporting Black Lives Matter? After all, it was only a consequence of free spe

by influx 9y ago

Curious if you feel Colin Kaepernick should have been fired and blacklisted for supporting Black Lives Matter? After all, it was only a consequence of free speech from his employers.

Mikeb85 9y ago
He wasn't fired or blacklisted for supporting BLM. His contract ran out and no one wants him because of his terrible performance of late. If it weren't for his political views no one would even be talking about him.
sushisource 9y ago
"Feel he should have been fired" and "Wouldn't throw a fit if he was fired" are different things. Do I think this guy should have been fired? I dunno. Not sure. I need more context. Am I upset he was fired? No. That's Google's choice, regardless of how good a choice it is or isn't.
- zimpenfish 9y ago
  > Do I think this guy should have been fired? It betrayed a spectacular lack of common sense and judgement for someone in a senior[1] role - which is exactly where you'd want those in spades. Also made his working position untenable since a senior role is going to need to get along and interact with many people. Also, also, his utter disregard for evidence and inability to make logical arguments would give me great pause as to his usefulness as a senior engineer. I'd have fired him first for being an idiot, second for his bullshit "scientism", and third having reprehensible views. [1] Disclaimer: I don't know if "senior" within Google is the same as "VP" in banks, ie just a defacto title you get after a while rather than a mark of actual competency.
jdavis703 9y ago
I don't think he should've been fired, no. But I also feel the NFL or team owners are within their rights as private citizens to not hire him. Does that make them racist? Sure. But being bigoted and supporting racist social policies in and of itself isn't inherently illegal.
- zimpenfish 9y ago
  > But being bigoted and supporting racist social policies in and of itself isn't inherently illegal. And, as a consequence, the US now has an immature tantrum-throwing child as President with a GOP doing nothing but enabling his worst actions.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
joelrunyon 9y ago
Colin wasn't fired. He opted out of his contract - making himself a free agent. http://www.49ers.com/news/article-2/Colin-Kaepernick-Opts-Out-of-Contract-Becomes-a-Free-Agent/55f3952d-1f83-4682-bf97-3c423ab26fa8 http://www.49ers.com/news/article-2/Colin-Kaepernick-Opts-Ou... This is like quitting your job and complaining you don't have a job.
- twentythree 9y ago
  That's not a fair comparison; Kaepernick would have been cut had he not opted out. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/05/31/john-lynch-49ers-would-have-cut-kaepernick-if-he-hadnt-opted-out/ http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/05/31/john-lynch-4... "We gave him the option, ‘You can opt out, we can release you, whatever.’ And he chose to opt out, but that was just a formality."
  - joelrunyon 9y ago
    I think it's more complicated than that. They didn't get along - evidenced by the fact he gave up almost $15M in guarantees to opt-out. https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2017/3/1/14599712/colin-kaepernick-contract-opt-out-49ers-free-agent https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2017/3/1/14599712/colin-kaepern... There's a lot of other issues here - it's unfair to say he got "fired" because of what he did last year. He's been very bad lately - huge dropoff since he went to the SuperBowl.
kevinburke 9y ago
I think the people signing worse quarterbacks than him are pointlessly making their teams worse. I didn't take a position on the Google firing above; I just pointed out that your employer can hold you accountable for things you say without violating your First Amendment rights. http://review.chicagobooth.edu/magazine/winter-2014/how-gary-becker-saw-the-scourge-of-discrimination http://review.chicagobooth.edu/magazine/winter-2014/how-gary...
- Mikeb85 9y ago
  Quarterbacks worse than him? SF had the second worst record in the league...
  - kevinburke 9y ago
    At this point he's being evaluated as a backup and teams are still passing on him. The other backup quarterbacks are not good. http://www.businessinsider.com/colin-kaepernick-backup-qb-argument-stat-check-2017-6 http://www.businessinsider.com/colin-kaepernick-backup-qb-ar...
    - Mikeb85 9y ago
      That article offers good arguments not to pick him. Add to the fact a former starter is going to demand a greater salary, and his weaknesses will be more well known than, say, a rookie or someone who's always been a backup. At this point Colin has peaked and declined, and everyone knows it. Edit - backups should be technically solid and be able to execute the same plays as the starter. Not flashy and unorthodox. When your starter is injured you don't want the whole team to have to change systems.

by influx 9y ago

Curious if you feel Colin Kaepernick should have been fired and blacklisted for supporting Black Lives Matter? After all, it was only a consequence of free speech from his employers.

Mikeb85 9y ago

He wasn't fired or blacklisted for supporting BLM. His contract ran out and no one wants him because of his terrible performance of late. If it weren't for his political views no one would even be talking about him.

sushisource 9y ago

"Feel he should have been fired" and "Wouldn't throw a fit if he was fired" are different things. Do I think this guy should have been fired? I dunno. Not sure. I need more context. Am I upset he was fired? No. That's Google's choice, regardless of how good a choice it is or isn't.

zimpenfish 9y ago
> Do I think this guy should have been fired? It betrayed a spectacular lack of common sense and judgement for someone in a senior[1] role - which is exactly where you'd want those in spades. Also made his working position untenable since a senior role is going to need to get along and interact with many people. Also, also, his utter disregard for evidence and inability to make logical arguments would give me great pause as to his usefulness as a senior engineer. I'd have fired him first for being an idiot, second for his bullshit "scientism", and third having reprehensible views. [1] Disclaimer: I don't know if "senior" within Google is the same as "VP" in banks, ie just a defacto title you get after a while rather than a mark of actual competency.

jdavis703 9y ago

I don't think he should've been fired, no. But I also feel the NFL or team owners are within their rights as private citizens to not hire him. Does that make them racist? Sure. But being bigoted and supporting racist social policies in and of itself isn't inherently illegal.

zimpenfish 9y ago
> But being bigoted and supporting racist social policies in and of itself isn't inherently illegal. And, as a consequence, the US now has an immature tantrum-throwing child as President with a GOP doing nothing but enabling his worst actions.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

joelrunyon 9y ago

Colin wasn't fired. He opted out of his contract - making himself a free agent. http://www.49ers.com/news/article-2/Colin-Kaepernick-Opts-Out-of-Contract-Becomes-a-Free-Agent/55f3952d-1f83-4682-bf97-3c423ab26fa8 http://www.49ers.com/news/article-2/Colin-Kaepernick-Opts-Ou... This is like quitting your job and complaining you don't have a job.

twentythree 9y ago
That's not a fair comparison; Kaepernick would have been cut had he not opted out. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/05/31/john-lynch-49ers-would-have-cut-kaepernick-if-he-hadnt-opted-out/ http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/05/31/john-lynch-4... "We gave him the option, ‘You can opt out, we can release you, whatever.’ And he chose to opt out, but that was just a formality."
- joelrunyon 9y ago
  I think it's more complicated than that. They didn't get along - evidenced by the fact he gave up almost $15M in guarantees to opt-out. https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2017/3/1/14599712/colin-kaepernick-contract-opt-out-49ers-free-agent https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2017/3/1/14599712/colin-kaepern... There's a lot of other issues here - it's unfair to say he got "fired" because of what he did last year. He's been very bad lately - huge dropoff since he went to the SuperBowl.

kevinburke 9y ago

I think the people signing worse quarterbacks than him are pointlessly making their teams worse. I didn't take a position on the Google firing above; I just pointed out that your employer can hold you accountable for things you say without violating your First Amendment rights. http://review.chicagobooth.edu/magazine/winter-2014/how-gary-becker-saw-the-scourge-of-discrimination http://review.chicagobooth.edu/magazine/winter-2014/how-gary...

Mikeb85 9y ago
Quarterbacks worse than him? SF had the second worst record in the league...
- kevinburke 9y ago
  At this point he's being evaluated as a backup and teams are still passing on him. The other backup quarterbacks are not good. http://www.businessinsider.com/colin-kaepernick-backup-qb-argument-stat-check-2017-6 http://www.businessinsider.com/colin-kaepernick-backup-qb-ar...
  - Mikeb85 9y ago
    That article offers good arguments not to pick him. Add to the fact a former starter is going to demand a greater salary, and his weaknesses will be more well known than, say, a rookie or someone who's always been a backup. At this point Colin has peaked and declined, and everyone knows it. Edit - backups should be technically solid and be able to execute the same plays as the starter. Not flashy and unorthodox. When your starter is injured you don't want the whole team to have to change systems.