4 ms·

> because his manifesto was a haphazard collection of good points, bad points, good arguments, lousy arguments, misrepresentations of others' views, and unstate

> because his manifesto was a haphazard collection of good points, bad points, good arguments, lousy arguments, misrepresentations of others' views, and unstated implications. Is this really an honest assessment? I haven't yet seen a single reply to the manifesto that addresses its points and counters the supposedly "lousy arguments" in a neutral tone and objective manner. Please point me to one if you have...

tunesmith 9y ago
Sure, the second paragraph of this is a good example: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14953024 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14953024
- Simon_says 9y ago
  > It's worth remembering that one of his conclusions was to end or replace gender-based diversity programs at Google. Given that, it's easy to understand why people would be upset. If gender-based diversity programs are responsible for qualified women getting jobs that they otherwise wouldn't have gotten due to bias, then the lack of that program means those women wouldn't have gotten those jobs. This is not exactly a strong counter-argument.
  - lurker69 9y ago
    > If gender-based diversity programs are responsible... > If... Nothing empirical in that sentence just assumption. And even if we assume that statement is true, on the other side of same coin are qualified men that didn't get job solely because of their genitalia.
    - Simon_says 9y ago
      Exactly. A very reasonable document is criticized as being "unscientific" or "discredited", and when pressed for specific inaccuracies, this is the best response? The left and corporate culture has gone full retard on this issue.
vyhd 9y ago
How about you write one, then? If you want an assessment that meets your definition of a neutral tone and objective manner, who better to provide it?
jezclaremurugan 9y ago
https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/so-about-this-googlers-manifesto-1e3773ed1788 https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/so-about-this-googlers-man... - this qualifies for me
- observation 9y ago
  He claims the author is ignorant of gender, yet the person has turned out to be a PhD in a Biology related field from Harvard.
  - williamsmj 9y ago
    He doesn't have a PhD. https://twitter.com/nitashatiku/status/894939560391565317 https://twitter.com/nitashatiku/status/894939560391565317. He was in the PhD program at Harvard for two years, and published nothing during that time.
    - observation 9y ago
      Was going to correct (posts don't have edit function), my other posts mention he has a Masters.
- yogaboll 9y ago
  Quote from the article: if anyone wishes to provide details as to how nearly every statement about gender in that entire document is actively incorrect,¹ and flies directly in the face of all research done in the field for decades, they should go for it. But I am neither a biologist, a psychologist, nor a sociologist, so I’ll leave that to someone else. This article specifically avoids countering the original article point-by-point. I would love to see an article or comment that does that.
- davidivadavid 9y ago
  Considering it starts with a straw man, continues in a highly emotional tone, doesn't address a single point of the original "manifesto", and is little more than a piece written to prop the author up ("I don't even work at Google anymore but I had to clean up after you, son.."), I fail to see that article as more than an embarrassment for the (very senior) guy who wrote it.

tunesmith 9y ago

Sure, the second paragraph of this is a good example: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14953024 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14953024

Simon_says 9y ago
> It's worth remembering that one of his conclusions was to end or replace gender-based diversity programs at Google. Given that, it's easy to understand why people would be upset. If gender-based diversity programs are responsible for qualified women getting jobs that they otherwise wouldn't have gotten due to bias, then the lack of that program means those women wouldn't have gotten those jobs. This is not exactly a strong counter-argument.
- lurker69 9y ago
  > If gender-based diversity programs are responsible... > If... Nothing empirical in that sentence just assumption. And even if we assume that statement is true, on the other side of same coin are qualified men that didn't get job solely because of their genitalia.
  - Simon_says 9y ago
    Exactly. A very reasonable document is criticized as being "unscientific" or "discredited", and when pressed for specific inaccuracies, this is the best response? The left and corporate culture has gone full retard on this issue.

vyhd 9y ago

How about you write one, then? If you want an assessment that meets your definition of a neutral tone and objective manner, who better to provide it?

jezclaremurugan 9y ago

https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/so-about-this-googlers-manifesto-1e3773ed1788 https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/so-about-this-googlers-man... - this qualifies for me

observation 9y ago
He claims the author is ignorant of gender, yet the person has turned out to be a PhD in a Biology related field from Harvard.
- williamsmj 9y ago
  He doesn't have a PhD. https://twitter.com/nitashatiku/status/894939560391565317 https://twitter.com/nitashatiku/status/894939560391565317. He was in the PhD program at Harvard for two years, and published nothing during that time.
  - observation 9y ago
    Was going to correct (posts don't have edit function), my other posts mention he has a Masters.
yogaboll 9y ago
Quote from the article: if anyone wishes to provide details as to how nearly every statement about gender in that entire document is actively incorrect,¹ and flies directly in the face of all research done in the field for decades, they should go for it. But I am neither a biologist, a psychologist, nor a sociologist, so I’ll leave that to someone else. This article specifically avoids countering the original article point-by-point. I would love to see an article or comment that does that.
davidivadavid 9y ago
Considering it starts with a straw man, continues in a highly emotional tone, doesn't address a single point of the original "manifesto", and is little more than a piece written to prop the author up ("I don't even work at Google anymore but I had to clean up after you, son.."), I fail to see that article as more than an embarrassment for the (very senior) guy who wrote it.