4 ms·

Stack Overflow's new "Web Apps" site is in public beta

60 points by mwsherman 16y ago

garyrichardson 16y ago
I've browsed around a bit. This site actually seems quite useful. If nothing else, it's a good sounding board for "What is the best web site for X"
- evilduck 16y ago
  Unless they change the "rules", I think it will suffer the same problem as the other Stacks: They don't handle duplicate questions very well. In succession, duplicates are annoying and detrimental, but on the other hand, the best answer in 2008 may not be the best answer in 2010 and there's no easy way to update old questions and bring attention to their need for new answers. The set of answers for broad questions at SO is gradually becoming stale and the new questions are beginning to become uselessly specific to the person who asks the question. Maybe a way to append or revise older questions as a lower-reputation user would help, and doing so would bring the question back into the community's foreground to be seen by fresh eyes. Edit: "They" meaning the website, the community and the SO engine combined, not necessarily one or the other individually.
  - digitallogic 16y ago
    This site seems like it would suffer even more so. On Joel's blog, the the announcement for this site [1] asked "Want to know how ... delete your Facebook account?". How long is the accepted answer to that question going to be up to date, and will it be updated every time Facebook tweaks their site to discourage account deletion? 1: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/items/2010/07/07.html http://www.joelonsoftware.com/items/2010/07/07.html
    - mhp 16y ago
      'will it be updated every time Facebook tweaks their site to discourage account deletion?' - that's the idea. 'How long is the accepted answer to that question going to be up to date?' - hopefully as soon as FB changes the system and someone realizes the answer is wrong.
      - blasdel 16y ago
        But their software is heavily reified against that sort of thing -- a new answer is made and then it's karma would have to surpass the existing one (which the karma-inflation problem makes easier) but it also needs to get accepted in place of the existing one, screwing over the original answerer. The already-accepted answer could also be community-wiki-edited beyond recognition. Pretending temporality doesn't exist doesn't make it go away.
      - evilduck 16y ago
        But the problem is that only the original poster can accept answers, and a newly added (and correct) answer may be pushed so far down the list of answers, it could take a needlessly long time to overcome the currently highest upvoted solution. Ideally, a user could report something as out of date, or the ranking algorithm would degrade the value of an answer as it ages (which would be a problem for ageless Q/A situations like traditional computer science questions).
ashconnor 16y ago
I'm not sure I get fragmenting into every little niche and creating a new site for it. Stackoverflow, ServerFault, SuperUser, MetaSO does this new StackExchange really not fit into any of the above?
- m_myers 16y ago
  Web app questions definitely don't belong on SO (unless you're developing them) or SF (unless you're administering them). They might work on SU, but they've been explicitly banned for some time. And Meta is only for discussing the SO network. So no, there's really no other place in the existing network for them.
  - blasdel 16y ago
    The segregation actually isn't so bad the more I think about it -- people with tons of karma from questions about mundane windows sysadmin and inane adolescent theming shouldn't be running roughshod over people trying to figure out how to do something in gmail.
    - mwsherman 16y ago
      That's right. The segmentation is about making sure that each site has a critical mass of experts, and enough of a focus that said experts won't be annoyed by off-topic questions. (Of course it's debatable where the line should be.) Joel and Jeff have said several times that "Google is the UI". So the segmentation doesn't hurt the "answer consumers", who'll come in through Google with little regard for which site is which, while benefiting the "producers", who do care.
  - chc 16y ago
    They really seem like they belong on Super User to me. I would think the Stack Overflow founders of all people would see the arbitrariness of treating Web applications and desktop applications as completely different things. Web apps are more like desktop apps than desktop apps are like plugins or computer hardware, yet those categories are allowed on Super User.
jusob 16y ago
Unfortunately this does not cover questions like "how to do get information X from Google Adsense or Google Analytics". Anybody knows a good place for such questions?
- mwsherman 16y ago
  http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/894/pro-webmasters http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/894/pro-webmasters
  - spolsky 16y ago
    If you're interested in the pro webmasters site, it's likely to go into closed beta in a matter of days... you should commit to the site today so that you can participate in the closed beta. The closed beta will be 7 days long after which we open the beta to the public.
zyb09 16y ago
To whomever put this custom skin over the SO Engine (and sure you're reading HN, aren't you?), that's an awesome job. This site looks really unique compared to Stackoverflow, Superuser etc. and quiet appealing too.
- rayvega 16y ago
  Here is the designer responsible for the look of the site: http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2010/07/our-designer-in-residence-jin-yang/ http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2010/07/our-designer-in-reside...
- Raphael 16y ago
  Are you kidding? The grid lines don't line up with anything.
  - aaronblohowiak 16y ago
    Chrome, OSX. The grid lines match the story separator lines and the baseline of all of the fonts. the "Top Questions" and the navigation tabs are off, but the rest is on. the drop shadow of the top bar is about 3px off from the top bar itself...
kleiba 16y ago
What a rip-off of metaoptimize!! j/k :-)

60 points by mwsherman 16y ago

I've browsed around a bit. This site actually seems quite useful. If nothing else, it's a good sounding board for "What is the best web site for X"

evilduck 16y ago
Unless they change the "rules", I think it will suffer the same problem as the other Stacks: They don't handle duplicate questions very well. In succession, duplicates are annoying and detrimental, but on the other hand, the best answer in 2008 may not be the best answer in 2010 and there's no easy way to update old questions and bring attention to their need for new answers. The set of answers for broad questions at SO is gradually becoming stale and the new questions are beginning to become uselessly specific to the person who asks the question. Maybe a way to append or revise older questions as a lower-reputation user would help, and doing so would bring the question back into the community's foreground to be seen by fresh eyes. Edit: "They" meaning the website, the community and the SO engine combined, not necessarily one or the other individually.
- digitallogic 16y ago
  This site seems like it would suffer even more so. On Joel's blog, the the announcement for this site [1] asked "Want to know how ... delete your Facebook account?". How long is the accepted answer to that question going to be up to date, and will it be updated every time Facebook tweaks their site to discourage account deletion? 1: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/items/2010/07/07.html http://www.joelonsoftware.com/items/2010/07/07.html
  - mhp 16y ago
    'will it be updated every time Facebook tweaks their site to discourage account deletion?' - that's the idea. 'How long is the accepted answer to that question going to be up to date?' - hopefully as soon as FB changes the system and someone realizes the answer is wrong.
    - blasdel 16y ago
      But their software is heavily reified against that sort of thing -- a new answer is made and then it's karma would have to surpass the existing one (which the karma-inflation problem makes easier) but it also needs to get accepted in place of the existing one, screwing over the original answerer. The already-accepted answer could also be community-wiki-edited beyond recognition. Pretending temporality doesn't exist doesn't make it go away.
    - evilduck 16y ago
      But the problem is that only the original poster can accept answers, and a newly added (and correct) answer may be pushed so far down the list of answers, it could take a needlessly long time to overcome the currently highest upvoted solution. Ideally, a user could report something as out of date, or the ranking algorithm would degrade the value of an answer as it ages (which would be a problem for ageless Q/A situations like traditional computer science questions).

ashconnor 16y ago

I'm not sure I get fragmenting into every little niche and creating a new site for it. Stackoverflow, ServerFault, SuperUser, MetaSO does this new StackExchange really not fit into any of the above?

m_myers 16y ago
Web app questions definitely don't belong on SO (unless you're developing them) or SF (unless you're administering them). They might work on SU, but they've been explicitly banned for some time. And Meta is only for discussing the SO network. So no, there's really no other place in the existing network for them.
- blasdel 16y ago
  The segregation actually isn't so bad the more I think about it -- people with tons of karma from questions about mundane windows sysadmin and inane adolescent theming shouldn't be running roughshod over people trying to figure out how to do something in gmail.
  - mwsherman 16y ago
    That's right. The segmentation is about making sure that each site has a critical mass of experts, and enough of a focus that said experts won't be annoyed by off-topic questions. (Of course it's debatable where the line should be.) Joel and Jeff have said several times that "Google is the UI". So the segmentation doesn't hurt the "answer consumers", who'll come in through Google with little regard for which site is which, while benefiting the "producers", who do care.
- chc 16y ago
  They really seem like they belong on Super User to me. I would think the Stack Overflow founders of all people would see the arbitrariness of treating Web applications and desktop applications as completely different things. Web apps are more like desktop apps than desktop apps are like plugins or computer hardware, yet those categories are allowed on Super User.

jusob 16y ago

Unfortunately this does not cover questions like "how to do get information X from Google Adsense or Google Analytics". Anybody knows a good place for such questions?

mwsherman 16y ago
http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/894/pro-webmasters http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/894/pro-webmasters
- spolsky 16y ago
  If you're interested in the pro webmasters site, it's likely to go into closed beta in a matter of days... you should commit to the site today so that you can participate in the closed beta. The closed beta will be 7 days long after which we open the beta to the public.

zyb09 16y ago

To whomever put this custom skin over the SO Engine (and sure you're reading HN, aren't you?), that's an awesome job. This site looks really unique compared to Stackoverflow, Superuser etc. and quiet appealing too.

rayvega 16y ago
Here is the designer responsible for the look of the site: http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2010/07/our-designer-in-residence-jin-yang/ http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2010/07/our-designer-in-reside...
Raphael 16y ago
Are you kidding? The grid lines don't line up with anything.
- aaronblohowiak 16y ago
  Chrome, OSX. The grid lines match the story separator lines and the baseline of all of the fonts. the "Top Questions" and the navigation tabs are off, but the rest is on. the drop shadow of the top bar is about 3px off from the top bar itself...

kleiba 16y ago

What a rip-off of metaoptimize!! j/k :-)