3 ms·

Helmets also make drivers drive closer to you [1]. Given that, I'm genuinely unsure whether helmets actually decrease the expected risk of injury. [1] https:/

Helmets also make drivers drive closer to you [1]. Given that, I'm genuinely unsure whether helmets actually decrease the expected risk of injury. [1] https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/strange-but-true-helmets-attract-cars-to-cyclists/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/strange-but-true-...

dahart 9y ago
You read the paragraph in that article you linked that ends with "When you do have that crash, you better have it on."? All you have to do to know for sure whether helmets result in more or less net risk of injury is look at the statistics for the people who've been killed wearing helmets vs not wearing helmets. http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/pedestrians-and-bicyclists/fatalityfacts/bicycles/2015 http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/pedestrians-and-bicyclists... Walker's research didn't show an increase in accidents or injuries, it showed drivers who are 3 feet away getting a little over 3 inches closer. I'm not personally more afraid of cars getting a little closer according to one guy than I am of the direct and overwhelming evidence supported by multiple studies of reduced risk of death when wearing a helmet. "The cars were giving him, on average, a very wide passing clearance already," he explains, noting that most vehicles typically stayed well over three feet from the bikes, rendering the 3.35-inch discrepancy to be insignificant." Also, my personal anecdata of getting buzzed by cars in the US is that it's happening less often as bike awareness goes up. In direct support of the article at the top, I suppose. I feel like cars are giving me more room now than they used to. Walker's study was 10 years ago, maybe we've already made up for the 3.4 inches already. So if you ride, for the sake of you and your family and friends, I hope you find confidence and pride in wearing your brain bucket.
- throwaway287391 9y ago
  > You read the paragraph in that article you linked that ends with "When you do have that crash, you better have it on."? Yes, but if helmets raise your risk of having a crash to begin with (due to cars driving closer to you or otherwise), it's unclear whether it's better to wear one or not. (Higher risk of less destructive crashes vs. lower risk of more destructive crashes.) > All you have to do to know for sure whether helmets result in more or less net risk of injury is look at the statistics for the people who've been killed wearing helmets vs not wearing helmets. I disagree -- that's correlation, not causation. Perhaps people who wear helmets are just more careful in general. (That seems pretty likely to me.)
  - dahart 9y ago
    > Yes, but if helmets raise your risk of having a crash to begin with That wasn't demonstrated in Walker's study. Neither correlation nor causation. > that's correlation, not causation. Perhaps people who wear helmets are just more careful in general. No, there is a lower death rate for riders given that they've been in an accident. That rules out rider behavior. Helmet wearers may have lower accident rates than non-wearers, but minor and major injuries often aren't reported, so we don't have great data on that. What we do know is that if you have an accident, your risk of death is lower if there was a helmet on your head. I'm not sure why that's surprising or debatable. It's armor, it puts shock absorbing material between colliding surfaces. It seems rather obvious it would reduce the severity of the collision. We use padding and shock absorbers and suspension systems everywhere... because they're effective. Having crashed quite a few times myself, and caused several minor and major injuries on my mountain bike, I'm pretty sure my helmet has saved me. Sometimes I wear body armor and a neck brace as well. My biking friends won't ride with me or let me ride without a helmet, and they expect the same of me. Anyway, some studies on the effectiveness of helmets have controlled specifically for rider behavior, and ruled that out as a factor in the lower death rates of helmet wearers. Here are some starting points, if you truly are genuinely unsure and want to do your own research. http://www.bhsi.org/shouldi.htm http://www.bhsi.org/shouldi.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2598379/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2598379/
analog31 9y ago
Ah, the University of Bath study... It's been cited so often that it's become a factoid, but it was barely scientific: The author is his own test subject. Nobody has attempted to reproduce the work. Why not just set up a video camera somewhere, and make an unbiased observation?

dahart 9y ago

You read the paragraph in that article you linked that ends with "When you do have that crash, you better have it on."? All you have to do to know for sure whether helmets result in more or less net risk of injury is look at the statistics for the people who've been killed wearing helmets vs not wearing helmets. http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/pedestrians-and-bicyclists/fatalityfacts/bicycles/2015 http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/pedestrians-and-bicyclists... Walker's research didn't show an increase in accidents or injuries, it showed drivers who are 3 feet away getting a little over 3 inches closer. I'm not personally more afraid of cars getting a little closer according to one guy than I am of the direct and overwhelming evidence supported by multiple studies of reduced risk of death when wearing a helmet. "The cars were giving him, on average, a very wide passing clearance already," he explains, noting that most vehicles typically stayed well over three feet from the bikes, rendering the 3.35-inch discrepancy to be insignificant." Also, my personal anecdata of getting buzzed by cars in the US is that it's happening less often as bike awareness goes up. In direct support of the article at the top, I suppose. I feel like cars are giving me more room now than they used to. Walker's study was 10 years ago, maybe we've already made up for the 3.4 inches already. So if you ride, for the sake of you and your family and friends, I hope you find confidence and pride in wearing your brain bucket.

throwaway287391 9y ago
> You read the paragraph in that article you linked that ends with "When you do have that crash, you better have it on."? Yes, but if helmets raise your risk of having a crash to begin with (due to cars driving closer to you or otherwise), it's unclear whether it's better to wear one or not. (Higher risk of less destructive crashes vs. lower risk of more destructive crashes.) > All you have to do to know for sure whether helmets result in more or less net risk of injury is look at the statistics for the people who've been killed wearing helmets vs not wearing helmets. I disagree -- that's correlation, not causation. Perhaps people who wear helmets are just more careful in general. (That seems pretty likely to me.)
- dahart 9y ago
  > Yes, but if helmets raise your risk of having a crash to begin with That wasn't demonstrated in Walker's study. Neither correlation nor causation. > that's correlation, not causation. Perhaps people who wear helmets are just more careful in general. No, there is a lower death rate for riders given that they've been in an accident. That rules out rider behavior. Helmet wearers may have lower accident rates than non-wearers, but minor and major injuries often aren't reported, so we don't have great data on that. What we do know is that if you have an accident, your risk of death is lower if there was a helmet on your head. I'm not sure why that's surprising or debatable. It's armor, it puts shock absorbing material between colliding surfaces. It seems rather obvious it would reduce the severity of the collision. We use padding and shock absorbers and suspension systems everywhere... because they're effective. Having crashed quite a few times myself, and caused several minor and major injuries on my mountain bike, I'm pretty sure my helmet has saved me. Sometimes I wear body armor and a neck brace as well. My biking friends won't ride with me or let me ride without a helmet, and they expect the same of me. Anyway, some studies on the effectiveness of helmets have controlled specifically for rider behavior, and ruled that out as a factor in the lower death rates of helmet wearers. Here are some starting points, if you truly are genuinely unsure and want to do your own research. http://www.bhsi.org/shouldi.htm http://www.bhsi.org/shouldi.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2598379/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2598379/

analog31 9y ago

Ah, the University of Bath study... It's been cited so often that it's become a factoid, but it was barely scientific: The author is his own test subject. Nobody has attempted to reproduce the work. Why not just set up a video camera somewhere, and make an unbiased observation?