5 ms·

I'm a US citizen, born an raised in this country, and a working software engineer in the Bay Area. I'm not sure I would score 30 points on this system.

lnreddy 9y ago
That is a feature, not a bug. The ideal US immigration system should only welcome extraordinary people into the country.
- gambiting 9y ago
  I do wonder why. The American dream was available to pretty much anyone willing to try it through the green card lottery. Someone with no money and no education could try coming to US and making it big like many other people before. Or is the green card lottery programme not being scrapped?
  - k-mcgrady 9y ago
    >> The American dream was available to pretty much anyone willing to try it through the green card lottery. Your odds of winning are something like 0.2%. If you're one of those selected I believe there's still only a 50% chance you will make it through as they select twice as many 'winners' as they have spots available. I applied for about 8 years I think without success. I then stopped after realising I had nothing to gain from moving to the US. Also, the program is limited to persons from certain countries (for example if you like in England/Scotland/Wales you cannot apply).
  - dakna 9y ago
    You actually need quite a bit of money to be eligible for the diversity visa AKA green card lottery. One of the requirements is that you are able to support yourself for weeks/months while you are looking for a job. Proof of funds is required, and it better be around $10k per person. Having said that, I still think you are on point about the American Dream available for everyone willing to work hard. It just starts before you enter the US since green cards are not handed out that easily even though it is called a lottery.
- erispoe 9y ago
  That relies on the premise that immigration of "ordinary" people is somehow detrimental to the existing US population. This is, to my knowledge, not supported by any fact or study.
  - dublinclontarf 9y ago
    > That relies on the premise that immigration of "ordinary" people is somehow detrimental to the existing US population. How so?
    - IanCal 9y ago
      If bringing in ordinary people is beneficial, then it seems reasonable to say an ideal system would allow that.
  - koolba 9y ago
    If you accept the premise that immigration itself should be limited to a finite quantity (per time period, say per year), it's not a leap to reason that importing highly skilled people is better for the economy than low skilled people. Low skilled immigrants compete against low skilled workers that are already here and depress their wages. High skilled workers do the same thing but at the top end with the added advantage of generating more tax dollars and GDP (since they have more income). At its core the question becomes: Is immigration a public policy to benefit those that are here (ie strengthen economy, unify familial bonds) or a charity offered to the rest of the world?
    - arethuza 9y ago
      Seems a bit harsh to describe immigration of people who are prepared to work and support themselves as "charity offered to the rest of the world". Edit: To be fair - I can see the argument for a supply of immigrant low skill workers potentially keeping wages depressed hitting existing US residents and while it might be good for the wealthy and businesses it might not be good for the majority. I'm in the UK and these arguments are very similar to those covered in the Brexit campaigns and while I voted Remain and I've since come to appreciate more of the arguments on the other side.
dingo_bat 9y ago
So? US citizens don't need to qualify. They were born there so they already have citizenship.

lnreddy 9y ago

That is a feature, not a bug. The ideal US immigration system should only welcome extraordinary people into the country.

gambiting 9y ago
I do wonder why. The American dream was available to pretty much anyone willing to try it through the green card lottery. Someone with no money and no education could try coming to US and making it big like many other people before. Or is the green card lottery programme not being scrapped?
- k-mcgrady 9y ago
  >> The American dream was available to pretty much anyone willing to try it through the green card lottery. Your odds of winning are something like 0.2%. If you're one of those selected I believe there's still only a 50% chance you will make it through as they select twice as many 'winners' as they have spots available. I applied for about 8 years I think without success. I then stopped after realising I had nothing to gain from moving to the US. Also, the program is limited to persons from certain countries (for example if you like in England/Scotland/Wales you cannot apply).
- dakna 9y ago
  You actually need quite a bit of money to be eligible for the diversity visa AKA green card lottery. One of the requirements is that you are able to support yourself for weeks/months while you are looking for a job. Proof of funds is required, and it better be around $10k per person. Having said that, I still think you are on point about the American Dream available for everyone willing to work hard. It just starts before you enter the US since green cards are not handed out that easily even though it is called a lottery.
erispoe 9y ago
That relies on the premise that immigration of "ordinary" people is somehow detrimental to the existing US population. This is, to my knowledge, not supported by any fact or study.
- dublinclontarf 9y ago
  > That relies on the premise that immigration of "ordinary" people is somehow detrimental to the existing US population. How so?
  - IanCal 9y ago
    If bringing in ordinary people is beneficial, then it seems reasonable to say an ideal system would allow that.
- koolba 9y ago
  If you accept the premise that immigration itself should be limited to a finite quantity (per time period, say per year), it's not a leap to reason that importing highly skilled people is better for the economy than low skilled people. Low skilled immigrants compete against low skilled workers that are already here and depress their wages. High skilled workers do the same thing but at the top end with the added advantage of generating more tax dollars and GDP (since they have more income). At its core the question becomes: Is immigration a public policy to benefit those that are here (ie strengthen economy, unify familial bonds) or a charity offered to the rest of the world?
  - arethuza 9y ago
    Seems a bit harsh to describe immigration of people who are prepared to work and support themselves as "charity offered to the rest of the world". Edit: To be fair - I can see the argument for a supply of immigrant low skill workers potentially keeping wages depressed hitting existing US residents and while it might be good for the wealthy and businesses it might not be good for the majority. I'm in the UK and these arguments are very similar to those covered in the Brexit campaigns and while I voted Remain and I've since come to appreciate more of the arguments on the other side.

dingo_bat 9y ago

So? US citizens don't need to qualify. They were born there so they already have citizenship.