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Why should I, as a reader, just try to find quality interesting content care about the identity of the author. Sorry, it seems really obvious to me and I have

by Mz 9y ago

Why should I, as a reader, just try to find quality interesting content care about the identity of the author. Sorry, it seems really obvious to me and I have heard it said before, so didn't feel I needed to spell it out: Female authors must be better than most to have any shot at getting published. So, women authors who do get published tend to be better authors than most male authors. You aren't required to care. Whether or not you care is on you, but if you want quality writing, there is evidence that due to the fact that women are discriminated against, IF they manage to get published, their writing will be of unusually high quality.

malandrew 9y ago
> Female authors must be better than most to have any shot at getting published. So, women authors who do get published tend to be better authors than most male authors. That's one hypothesis. Another equally valid hypothesis is that those that were published were just lucky enough to send their manuscripts to agents and publishers that don't have a bias. A corollary to your hypothesis is that there are publishers and agents out there with the same "correct injustice" mindset that are publishing women just because they are women. How do I know this isn't the case? Unless you have some objective measure of quality to measure books, you're just spouting bullshit conclusions that conform to your beliefs. Nothing more. Nothing less. Might I suggest that you try the null hypothesis? https://byrslf.co/the-null-hypothesis-loves-you-and-wants-you-to-be-happy-3189413d8cd0 https://byrslf.co/the-null-hypothesis-loves-you-and-wants-yo... FWIW, the essay I linked to was written by a woman. By your logic, you're morally obligated to read it.
- Mz 9y ago
  FWIW, the essay I linked to was written by a woman. By your logic, you're morally obligated to read it. I didn't make a moral argument anywhere. You asked "Why should I, as a reader, just try to find quality interesting content care about the identity of the author." And I suggested there is evidence that women authors need to be better to have any hope of getting published at all. As I noted above, you have no obligation whatsoever to care about the author's identity. I was merely answering your question very literally and in good faith. But, your many remarks here strongly suggest it wasn't actually a good faith question and you trying to do this "gotcha" just makes it clear that your real intent is to completely piss on the idea that anyone should do anything for "moral" reasons (a la supporting diversity). But, I wasn't making a moral argument.
  - malandrew 9y ago
    > Female authors must be better is not the same as > there is evidence that women authors need to be better The former is a conclusion. The latter is not. The latter should be further be qualified as "there is evidence that women authors [may] need to be better ... [, but further investigation into causality would be required to confirm this]". Statements of fact and foregone conclusions without strong support merit the skepticism they are met with. If someone said "Male authors must be better because they are published more often", I would expect that statement to be met with the same skepticism.
    - Mz 9y ago
      The full original statement involves plenty of qualifiers: Sorry, it seems really obvious to me and I have heard it said before, so didn't feel I needed to spell it out: Female authors must be better than most to have any shot at getting published. "it seems obvious to me" and "I have heard it said before" etc. You very much look like you are trolling me at this point. So, I think I am done because, wow, I feel like I need a shower for having made the mistake of trying to engage you in good faith.
      - bochengkor 9y ago
        Hey, I'm not taking sides, but just want to say don't be discouraged! Discussing over the internet lacks certain dimensions that face-to-face discussions have. It's hard to sense the tone and full intention of the other party, and thus harder for each side to re-calibrate what they are about to say. Therefore I always have high threshold for miscommunication over the internet.

by Mz 9y ago

malandrew 9y ago

> Female authors must be better than most to have any shot at getting published. So, women authors who do get published tend to be better authors than most male authors. That's one hypothesis. Another equally valid hypothesis is that those that were published were just lucky enough to send their manuscripts to agents and publishers that don't have a bias. A corollary to your hypothesis is that there are publishers and agents out there with the same "correct injustice" mindset that are publishing women just because they are women. How do I know this isn't the case? Unless you have some objective measure of quality to measure books, you're just spouting bullshit conclusions that conform to your beliefs. Nothing more. Nothing less. Might I suggest that you try the null hypothesis? https://byrslf.co/the-null-hypothesis-loves-you-and-wants-you-to-be-happy-3189413d8cd0 https://byrslf.co/the-null-hypothesis-loves-you-and-wants-yo... FWIW, the essay I linked to was written by a woman. By your logic, you're morally obligated to read it.

Mz 9y ago
FWIW, the essay I linked to was written by a woman. By your logic, you're morally obligated to read it. I didn't make a moral argument anywhere. You asked "Why should I, as a reader, just try to find quality interesting content care about the identity of the author." And I suggested there is evidence that women authors need to be better to have any hope of getting published at all. As I noted above, you have no obligation whatsoever to care about the author's identity. I was merely answering your question very literally and in good faith. But, your many remarks here strongly suggest it wasn't actually a good faith question and you trying to do this "gotcha" just makes it clear that your real intent is to completely piss on the idea that anyone should do anything for "moral" reasons (a la supporting diversity). But, I wasn't making a moral argument.
- malandrew 9y ago
  > Female authors must be better is not the same as > there is evidence that women authors need to be better The former is a conclusion. The latter is not. The latter should be further be qualified as "there is evidence that women authors [may] need to be better ... [, but further investigation into causality would be required to confirm this]". Statements of fact and foregone conclusions without strong support merit the skepticism they are met with. If someone said "Male authors must be better because they are published more often", I would expect that statement to be met with the same skepticism.
  - Mz 9y ago
    The full original statement involves plenty of qualifiers: Sorry, it seems really obvious to me and I have heard it said before, so didn't feel I needed to spell it out: Female authors must be better than most to have any shot at getting published. "it seems obvious to me" and "I have heard it said before" etc. You very much look like you are trolling me at this point. So, I think I am done because, wow, I feel like I need a shower for having made the mistake of trying to engage you in good faith.
    - bochengkor 9y ago
      Hey, I'm not taking sides, but just want to say don't be discouraged! Discussing over the internet lacks certain dimensions that face-to-face discussions have. It's hard to sense the tone and full intention of the other party, and thus harder for each side to re-calibrate what they are about to say. Therefore I always have high threshold for miscommunication over the internet.