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Oh look, yet another article about a country that's doing education better than us here in the US. And the funny thing is that they all seem to do things in dif

by zhemao 9y ago

Oh look, yet another article about a country that's doing education better than us here in the US. And the funny thing is that they all seem to do things in different ways. You know what I think the problem is? Americans on the whole just don't care about public education. Either in terms of quality or equity.

jmknoll 9y ago
While we've got the cynicism out, I'll do you one better. I think its that Americans on the whole just don't care about public anything. Public education, public healthcare, public transportation, public libraries, public lands. Decades of the Republican party screaming that government is the enemy while gutting every public institution that it can get its hands on has led to a real, tangible decline in the quality of public services. Then from here you get into a vicious cycle of "Wow, our train system is horrible. But I'm already paying for my car; I don't want to have to pay for that chump who can't afford a car to get to work." Or "What a shame about the state of our local school. But I'm already paying for little Billy to go to Catholic school. Why should I pay for the neighbor's education as well?" Not sure about how we get ourselves out of this mess. But I feel like just generally giving a shit about our neighbors and communities would be a good start. Seems like we're heading in the wrong direction for the time being though.
- zhemao 9y ago
  Very true. I don't think the Republicans are solely to blame though. I live in the SF Bay Area, definitely a very blue part of the country. Despite pretty steep taxes, our public transportation and public schools aren't much to look at. Better than other parts of the country, probably, but it ain't Canada. Even when there's a political will, there doesn't seem to be much know-how in how to actually provision public infrastructure and services in an efficient way.
- ghufran_syed 9y ago
  Most public education is run by cities in the US, and controlled locally. If the "Republicans" are the problem, shouldn't we see better education results in Democrat controlled areas, of which there are clearly many in the US? Seeing as there is no such difference to my knowledge, I would suggest that your assertion is unsupported by the facts.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
alacombe 9y ago
Coming from Europe, I can tell you that secondary Canadian education is laughable at best.
- x0ra 9y ago
  I can confirm from experience, Canadians have pretty poor knowledge of history and world geography. Also, I did more physics and chemistry by the end of high school than first year university students. As for university level, I was taking (and passing) master level classes while being half though my French Engineering school (where I went as deep as taking quantum physics course a year before). Also, at $WORK, we went though intern resume recently, and the level is pretty laughable as well, eg. "Practical knowledge: resistor, capacitor and power drill". [sic]
- narak 9y ago
  Please expound...
- zhemao 9y ago
  And if you came to the US and saw our public schools here, you'd probably die of laughter.
- avip 9y ago
  I had the exact same impression, yet somehow they nail it in OECD comparative tests.
  - johan_larson 9y ago
    Having gone through the Canadian education system, I would guess that Canada's high score comes from doing a good job on the lower percentiles, 1-50 or so. The system is slow and repetitive in the lower grades; its focus is getting everyone up to basic standards rather than challenging the best students. But if you're at all clever and diligent, it's boring. Tracking happens late, at entry to high school (grade 9), where they split you up into academic, regular, and vocational tracks. From there on things move at a more respectable pace, at least in the academic track. But at that point the top-track students are already years behind their peers in other systems that moved faster and tracked sooner. I would guess the top students coming out of high school are about two years behind students in academic tracks in other countries, like the UK or Germany.

by zhemao 9y ago

jmknoll 9y ago

While we've got the cynicism out, I'll do you one better. I think its that Americans on the whole just don't care about public anything. Public education, public healthcare, public transportation, public libraries, public lands. Decades of the Republican party screaming that government is the enemy while gutting every public institution that it can get its hands on has led to a real, tangible decline in the quality of public services. Then from here you get into a vicious cycle of "Wow, our train system is horrible. But I'm already paying for my car; I don't want to have to pay for that chump who can't afford a car to get to work." Or "What a shame about the state of our local school. But I'm already paying for little Billy to go to Catholic school. Why should I pay for the neighbor's education as well?" Not sure about how we get ourselves out of this mess. But I feel like just generally giving a shit about our neighbors and communities would be a good start. Seems like we're heading in the wrong direction for the time being though.

zhemao 9y ago
Very true. I don't think the Republicans are solely to blame though. I live in the SF Bay Area, definitely a very blue part of the country. Despite pretty steep taxes, our public transportation and public schools aren't much to look at. Better than other parts of the country, probably, but it ain't Canada. Even when there's a political will, there doesn't seem to be much know-how in how to actually provision public infrastructure and services in an efficient way.
ghufran_syed 9y ago
Most public education is run by cities in the US, and controlled locally. If the "Republicans" are the problem, shouldn't we see better education results in Democrat controlled areas, of which there are clearly many in the US? Seeing as there is no such difference to my knowledge, I would suggest that your assertion is unsupported by the facts.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

alacombe 9y ago

Coming from Europe, I can tell you that secondary Canadian education is laughable at best.

x0ra 9y ago
I can confirm from experience, Canadians have pretty poor knowledge of history and world geography. Also, I did more physics and chemistry by the end of high school than first year university students. As for university level, I was taking (and passing) master level classes while being half though my French Engineering school (where I went as deep as taking quantum physics course a year before). Also, at $WORK, we went though intern resume recently, and the level is pretty laughable as well, eg. "Practical knowledge: resistor, capacitor and power drill". [sic]
narak 9y ago
Please expound...
zhemao 9y ago
And if you came to the US and saw our public schools here, you'd probably die of laughter.
avip 9y ago
I had the exact same impression, yet somehow they nail it in OECD comparative tests.
- johan_larson 9y ago
  Having gone through the Canadian education system, I would guess that Canada's high score comes from doing a good job on the lower percentiles, 1-50 or so. The system is slow and repetitive in the lower grades; its focus is getting everyone up to basic standards rather than challenging the best students. But if you're at all clever and diligent, it's boring. Tracking happens late, at entry to high school (grade 9), where they split you up into academic, regular, and vocational tracks. From there on things move at a more respectable pace, at least in the academic track. But at that point the top-track students are already years behind their peers in other systems that moved faster and tracked sooner. I would guess the top students coming out of high school are about two years behind students in academic tracks in other countries, like the UK or Germany.