4 ms·

No, but it does show that Walmart is at least trying to not be an evil megacorporation.

by j_baker 16y ago

eru 16y ago
Selling me cheap stuff of reasonable quality is all I ask my retailers to do. (Or alternatively, higher quality at higher prices. Depends on what I am looking for at the moment.) No other moral requirements needed.
- mattmillr 16y ago
  I'd say they need not be "morally net positive," but I'd prefer they didn't engage in practices that are morally detrimental. Or, you don't have to sponsor a tree-planting program, but please don't irresponsibly dispose of all that used motor oil you're collecting.
- BrandonM 16y ago
  Even if it is to the detriment of society at large, including you? I don't know if it's changed in the last couple of years, but Wal-Mart used to help its employees apply for food stamps, Medicaid, and other aid programs because they didn't pay them enough. They performed an experiment that showed that having a single security guard patrol the parking lot at night completely eliminated crime (mugging, car break-ins, etc. that occur with regularity in Wal-Mart parking lots), but they did not put it into effect to save what? $75,000 per year? They have been damaging to the environment in several cases and often tend to kill the local economy in small towns. Just because a business sells something that seems cheap, that doesn't mean it actually is cheap. Consider the portion of your taxes that is going to supplement the workers' income, to pay police to address crimes that occur in Wal-Mart parking lots, to pay extra taxes because Wal-Mart only enters areas that will give them tax breaks, and so on. The way that corporations are designed precludes them from being moral. Society would be much better off if we could restructure the incentives of corporate America to make morality part of their make-up.
  - eru 16y ago
    > I don't know if it's changed in the last couple of years, but Wal-Mart used to help its employees apply for food stamps, Medicaid, and other aid programs because they didn't pay them enough. If they can get people to work for them at those wages, and they are happy with the employees they get, why not? I am glad that we don't have a minimum wage in Germany (in most sectors anyway). > They performed an experiment that showed that having a single security guard patrol the parking lot at night completely eliminated crime (mugging, car break-ins, etc. that occur with regularity in Wal-Mart parking lots), but they did not put it into effect to save what? $75,000 per year? Why don't the people who benefit from no crime pool their money and hire a security guard? > [...] and often tend to kill the local economy in small towns. Sources please. I know of one study about good effects. > The way that corporations are designed precludes them from being moral. Society would be much better off if we could restructure the incentives of corporate America to make morality part of their make-up. I agree wholeheartedly. Internalize externalities. And this isn't confined to America, where I do not live.
    - BrandonM 16y ago
      > If they can get people to work for them at those wages, and they are happy with the employees they get, why not? I'm not saying it's bad for the employees, I'm saying that Wal-Mart shoppers are paying more than they think. Wal-Mart sells stuff so cheap in part because they pay their workers low wages. The only way that works is because our tax money is being used to subsidize that income. Thus the cost of the things we buy at Wal-Mart are higher than the ticket price. > Why don't the people who benefit from no crime pool their money and hire a security guard? You mean the shoppers? The workers? Arguably the most efficient method of pooling this money would be for Wal-Mart to charge a little bit more in order to pay someone to patrol their own parking lot. > Sources please. I know of one study about good effects. I don't have sources for this, only first-hand experience. Smaller businesses are owned locally. They order inventory locally, and they spend the majority of their profits locally. Thus for the most part, money is being circulated about in the small town and everyone is getting the goods and services they need. When Wal-Mart comes in, the merchandise is coming from not only outside the town, but often outside the country. Any profits they make are distributed to shareholders, or used for building more Wal-Marts elsewhere. By knocking several local businesses (mechanic, produce stand, general store, pharmacy, hardware store) out of business, they eliminate more jobs than they create while siphoning money out of the town, money which would have otherwise just been recirculated.
hugh3 16y ago
Really? Racist discrimination in lending policies is non-evil nowadays?
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]

No, but it does show that Walmart is at least trying to not be an evil megacorporation.

by j_baker 16y ago

No, but it does show that Walmart is at least trying to not be an evil megacorporation.

eru 16y ago

Selling me cheap stuff of reasonable quality is all I ask my retailers to do. (Or alternatively, higher quality at higher prices. Depends on what I am looking for at the moment.) No other moral requirements needed.

mattmillr 16y ago
I'd say they need not be "morally net positive," but I'd prefer they didn't engage in practices that are morally detrimental. Or, you don't have to sponsor a tree-planting program, but please don't irresponsibly dispose of all that used motor oil you're collecting.
BrandonM 16y ago
Even if it is to the detriment of society at large, including you? I don't know if it's changed in the last couple of years, but Wal-Mart used to help its employees apply for food stamps, Medicaid, and other aid programs because they didn't pay them enough. They performed an experiment that showed that having a single security guard patrol the parking lot at night completely eliminated crime (mugging, car break-ins, etc. that occur with regularity in Wal-Mart parking lots), but they did not put it into effect to save what? $75,000 per year? They have been damaging to the environment in several cases and often tend to kill the local economy in small towns. Just because a business sells something that seems cheap, that doesn't mean it actually is cheap. Consider the portion of your taxes that is going to supplement the workers' income, to pay police to address crimes that occur in Wal-Mart parking lots, to pay extra taxes because Wal-Mart only enters areas that will give them tax breaks, and so on. The way that corporations are designed precludes them from being moral. Society would be much better off if we could restructure the incentives of corporate America to make morality part of their make-up.
- eru 16y ago
  > I don't know if it's changed in the last couple of years, but Wal-Mart used to help its employees apply for food stamps, Medicaid, and other aid programs because they didn't pay them enough. If they can get people to work for them at those wages, and they are happy with the employees they get, why not? I am glad that we don't have a minimum wage in Germany (in most sectors anyway). > They performed an experiment that showed that having a single security guard patrol the parking lot at night completely eliminated crime (mugging, car break-ins, etc. that occur with regularity in Wal-Mart parking lots), but they did not put it into effect to save what? $75,000 per year? Why don't the people who benefit from no crime pool their money and hire a security guard? > [...] and often tend to kill the local economy in small towns. Sources please. I know of one study about good effects. > The way that corporations are designed precludes them from being moral. Society would be much better off if we could restructure the incentives of corporate America to make morality part of their make-up. I agree wholeheartedly. Internalize externalities. And this isn't confined to America, where I do not live.
  - BrandonM 16y ago
    > If they can get people to work for them at those wages, and they are happy with the employees they get, why not? I'm not saying it's bad for the employees, I'm saying that Wal-Mart shoppers are paying more than they think. Wal-Mart sells stuff so cheap in part because they pay their workers low wages. The only way that works is because our tax money is being used to subsidize that income. Thus the cost of the things we buy at Wal-Mart are higher than the ticket price. > Why don't the people who benefit from no crime pool their money and hire a security guard? You mean the shoppers? The workers? Arguably the most efficient method of pooling this money would be for Wal-Mart to charge a little bit more in order to pay someone to patrol their own parking lot. > Sources please. I know of one study about good effects. I don't have sources for this, only first-hand experience. Smaller businesses are owned locally. They order inventory locally, and they spend the majority of their profits locally. Thus for the most part, money is being circulated about in the small town and everyone is getting the goods and services they need. When Wal-Mart comes in, the merchandise is coming from not only outside the town, but often outside the country. Any profits they make are distributed to shareholders, or used for building more Wal-Marts elsewhere. By knocking several local businesses (mechanic, produce stand, general store, pharmacy, hardware store) out of business, they eliminate more jobs than they create while siphoning money out of the town, money which would have otherwise just been recirculated.

hugh3 16y ago

Really? Racist discrimination in lending policies is non-evil nowadays?

deleted 16y ago
[deleted]