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Has there been consensus on whether renewables can power our society and industry on their own? Or for that matter generate more power than we currently need to

Has there been consensus on whether renewables can power our society and industry on their own? Or for that matter generate more power than we currently need to drive further progress?

toomuchtodo 9y ago
It only takes a few hours of sunlight to power humanity for a year. The amount of energy is not the question, it's scaling up collection.
- elsonrodriguez 9y ago
  For a while the amount of energy is certainly a question. If it takes 100 gigawatts to produce a solar panel, but that panel only returns 75 gigawatts over its usable lifespan (including maintenance), then that's not a good look. Even if solar generated 1.25 watts per watt to contruct/transport/install/maintain, it still isn't enough. Now if solar is at the point where it was generate 5 watts per 1 watt, we're in business.
  - toomuchtodo 9y ago
    Google "solar pv eroei". We are past the point of positive energy return.
    - elsonrodriguez 9y ago
      Wikipedia says: 80.0 for Coal 100.0 for Hydro 75 for Nuclear 18.0 for Wind 6.8 for PV Solar I saw lower estimates for PV solar elsewhere hovering around 1.0 though, apparently the methods are controversial. Either way, 6.8 is a still science experiment territory compared to other methods.
      - toomuchtodo 9y ago
        Come on, knock out being disingenuous. Science experiment territory? California and Germany have so much solar generation, they're having to take active measures to deal with the supply. And solar PV manufacturing capacity is only growing each year. The U.K. Is closing the last of its coal plants in less than 5 years: https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jul/19/how-coal-lost-power-britain https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jul/19/how-coal-lo...
        elsonrodriguez 9y ago
        That article shows a graph indicating that Gas is taking over for the lack of coal plants, and wind/solar are plateaued. People want a high return on their energy investment to power modern society. I'm sure solar will get better, and I encourage the fledgling consumer market and small-scale deployments to improve the tech, but it's not ready today, and the longer idealists keep peddling the idea that it IS ready, the longer we accelerate global warming.
ams6110 9y ago
If you consider only electrical power generation, in some areas, yes renewable are competitive for some hours of the day. As a fraction of our total energy consumption, they barely register.

Has there been consensus on whether renewables can power our society and industry on their own? Or for that matter generate more power than we currently need to drive further progress?

toomuchtodo 9y ago

It only takes a few hours of sunlight to power humanity for a year. The amount of energy is not the question, it's scaling up collection.

elsonrodriguez 9y ago
For a while the amount of energy is certainly a question. If it takes 100 gigawatts to produce a solar panel, but that panel only returns 75 gigawatts over its usable lifespan (including maintenance), then that's not a good look. Even if solar generated 1.25 watts per watt to contruct/transport/install/maintain, it still isn't enough. Now if solar is at the point where it was generate 5 watts per 1 watt, we're in business.
- toomuchtodo 9y ago
  Google "solar pv eroei". We are past the point of positive energy return.
  - elsonrodriguez 9y ago
    Wikipedia says: 80.0 for Coal 100.0 for Hydro 75 for Nuclear 18.0 for Wind 6.8 for PV Solar I saw lower estimates for PV solar elsewhere hovering around 1.0 though, apparently the methods are controversial. Either way, 6.8 is a still science experiment territory compared to other methods.
    - toomuchtodo 9y ago
      Come on, knock out being disingenuous. Science experiment territory? California and Germany have so much solar generation, they're having to take active measures to deal with the supply. And solar PV manufacturing capacity is only growing each year. The U.K. Is closing the last of its coal plants in less than 5 years: https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jul/19/how-coal-lost-power-britain https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jul/19/how-coal-lo...
      - elsonrodriguez 9y ago
        That article shows a graph indicating that Gas is taking over for the lack of coal plants, and wind/solar are plateaued. People want a high return on their energy investment to power modern society. I'm sure solar will get better, and I encourage the fledgling consumer market and small-scale deployments to improve the tech, but it's not ready today, and the longer idealists keep peddling the idea that it IS ready, the longer we accelerate global warming.

ams6110 9y ago

If you consider only electrical power generation, in some areas, yes renewable are competitive for some hours of the day. As a fraction of our total energy consumption, they barely register.