4 ms·

Even though it's not the real machine it's still a lot closer to it than you get from the higher level languages mentioned by parent commenter like they said.

pcwalton 9y ago
Once you have the concept of user-defined aggregate types that are meaningful to the semantics of your VM (which C and C++ definitely do), then you're pretty far away from the machine. The difference between the C VM and the .NET VM is not nearly as wide as the difference between the native instruction set and the C VM.
- Iv 9y ago
  That's the point: C++ allows to go pretty high on the abstract side, but it gives all the tools to map how the high level abstractions are implemented on the low level side.
  - pjmlp 9y ago
    I think that while it is true, and I am a big C++ fan, given it was my path after Turbo Pascal, exactly because I am a fan of Wirth and Xerox PARC languages I also know there are better paths. An example is the work being done in .NET Native, C#'s roadmap up to 8 picking up Midori's work, D, Swift, Java 10 and so on. C++ got this position, because the others stop caring about those issues. Now that they finally started caring about them, lets see what the future holds.
    - Iv 9y ago
      Oh like I said I have a love-hate thing with C++. Nowadays I mostly do C# and python, with a bit of Java. I only rely on C++ when I have to do brutal per pixel computer vision algorithms. In most cases you can rely on libraries to do the heavy duty (and then I stick to python or C#) but sometime you have to take the big C++ hammer and try to not hit your fingers with it.
      - pjmlp 9y ago
        I see, that is similar to me. I spend most of my time nowadays between Java and .NET languages, with some JavaScript when doing Web stuff. Diving into C++ means I am doing OS integration work, like Android's NDK, COM, UWP APIs exposed only to C++, CLR and JVM native APIs. So I guess I kind of share the same love-hate thing as you.

pcwalton 9y ago

Once you have the concept of user-defined aggregate types that are meaningful to the semantics of your VM (which C and C++ definitely do), then you're pretty far away from the machine. The difference between the C VM and the .NET VM is not nearly as wide as the difference between the native instruction set and the C VM.

Iv 9y ago
That's the point: C++ allows to go pretty high on the abstract side, but it gives all the tools to map how the high level abstractions are implemented on the low level side.
- pjmlp 9y ago
  I think that while it is true, and I am a big C++ fan, given it was my path after Turbo Pascal, exactly because I am a fan of Wirth and Xerox PARC languages I also know there are better paths. An example is the work being done in .NET Native, C#'s roadmap up to 8 picking up Midori's work, D, Swift, Java 10 and so on. C++ got this position, because the others stop caring about those issues. Now that they finally started caring about them, lets see what the future holds.
  - Iv 9y ago
    Oh like I said I have a love-hate thing with C++. Nowadays I mostly do C# and python, with a bit of Java. I only rely on C++ when I have to do brutal per pixel computer vision algorithms. In most cases you can rely on libraries to do the heavy duty (and then I stick to python or C#) but sometime you have to take the big C++ hammer and try to not hit your fingers with it.
    - pjmlp 9y ago
      I see, that is similar to me. I spend most of my time nowadays between Java and .NET languages, with some JavaScript when doing Web stuff. Diving into C++ means I am doing OS integration work, like Android's NDK, COM, UWP APIs exposed only to C++, CLR and JVM native APIs. So I guess I kind of share the same love-hate thing as you.