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Only thing that concerns Apple is to make money. They don't have a moral ground on issues like these because they are a business. Don't tell us you would say "

Only thing that concerns Apple is to make money. They don't have a moral ground on issues like these because they are a business. Don't tell us you would say "no".

aluhut 9y ago
Sure I would. Chinese market is already dominated by Android. Only those with a lot of money can buy Apple and people with a lot of money have influence. I would love to see the party trying to come up with an excuse for their VIPs and their angry daughters for an Apple block.
- fma 9y ago
  That is a misperception. You think Apple made so much money in China because only the rich but iPhones? Chinese people are willing to save/spend several months of their salary for the newest iPhone due to its status symbol. If anything will add to the further downfall of Apple in China, it stripping functionality of the most popular mobile payment app in China. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-04-19/tencent-s-wechat-abolishes-tipping-feature-on-apple-iphones https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-04-19/tencent-s...
  - aluhut 9y ago
    So this is part of a Chinese Government strategy to get Apple out of the market? Even more reasons to not do it. If Chinese Government decided they want you out, you will be out. Why not take some advertisement with them for the rest of the world? They surely knew how that works with the FBI problem.
IBM 9y ago
They absolutely stake out moral positions on issues like these all the time. The difference is they only do it in the West where rule of law prevails and they can actually exert influence. They've done it with various anti-LGBT efforts that have taken place around the US, they've done it with the fight with the FBI and they're doing it right now in Australia [1], among others. What they don't do is shoot themselves in the head in some misguided attempt at ideological purity. [1] https://www.macrumors.com/2017/07/20/apple-talks-australian-government-encryption/ https://www.macrumors.com/2017/07/20/apple-talks-australian-...
- riffraff 9y ago
  > rule of law prevails well, according to the post, they are actually complying with the law even now. The law might suck, but it's the law.
  - aphextron 9y ago
    There's a big difference between "rule of law" and "rule by law"
veidr 9y ago
Speak for yourself, dude. I would say "no". Tons of us would say "no". There are various things on this spectrum that any business can choose to do, or not do: use child labor, use political prison labor, dump toxic waste in public streams and rivers (after funding lobbyists to make it legal), etc.
- gthbdk 9y ago
  Another hard 'no' here. There's a even strong chance I'd actively hamper company operations surrounding the project, and bust out psychological warfare on management until fired.
  - justadeveloper2 9y ago
    Me too. The point about Apple is that they are abetting human rights violations. The Chinese treat their people like animals.
    - saimiam 9y ago
      This is just crazy talk @ The Chinese treat their people like animals. Millions lifted out of poverty. Nationalistic fervor. Chinese tourists traveling abroad (shows affluence.) I'm no China apologist but we could do with less grandstanding overall.
    - zhte415 9y ago
      >The Chinese treat their people like animals. The Chinese are the People, that's the point. Socialism. That's the definition of socialism. The way you phrase 'The Chinese treat their people' is what socialism exists to fight against... or that's the ideological angle... You cannot confuse nation, nationality, and identity for mainland China. They're rolled into one, which is perfect for the current hegemony.
- kryptiskt 9y ago
  Even simpler, they could just allow sideloading of apps so they don't have to be the gatekeeper defending China's interests.
pjmlp 9y ago
Actually those silly trainings that most of us have to do at companies of similar size about company culture say exactly that, that it is preferable to lose a business than do immoral stuff. Of course no one takes them seriously, because the actual reality on the field is that nothing other than profits matter.
justadeveloper2 9y ago
Oh, I see, they only take on "moral" issues when it comes to the US elections? Companies like Apple, Google, and Facebook can sway the world right into totalitarianism via their support of censorship and disregard for basic human rights. If these companies do side with the least common denominator, where does that leave the rest of us?
- jpatokal 9y ago
  Google does not censor search results in China and consequently remains largely blocked there to this day.

Only thing that concerns Apple is to make money. They don't have a moral ground on issues like these because they are a business. Don't tell us you would say "no".

aluhut 9y ago

Sure I would. Chinese market is already dominated by Android. Only those with a lot of money can buy Apple and people with a lot of money have influence. I would love to see the party trying to come up with an excuse for their VIPs and their angry daughters for an Apple block.

fma 9y ago
That is a misperception. You think Apple made so much money in China because only the rich but iPhones? Chinese people are willing to save/spend several months of their salary for the newest iPhone due to its status symbol. If anything will add to the further downfall of Apple in China, it stripping functionality of the most popular mobile payment app in China. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-04-19/tencent-s-wechat-abolishes-tipping-feature-on-apple-iphones https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-04-19/tencent-s...
- aluhut 9y ago
  So this is part of a Chinese Government strategy to get Apple out of the market? Even more reasons to not do it. If Chinese Government decided they want you out, you will be out. Why not take some advertisement with them for the rest of the world? They surely knew how that works with the FBI problem.

IBM 9y ago

They absolutely stake out moral positions on issues like these all the time. The difference is they only do it in the West where rule of law prevails and they can actually exert influence. They've done it with various anti-LGBT efforts that have taken place around the US, they've done it with the fight with the FBI and they're doing it right now in Australia [1], among others. What they don't do is shoot themselves in the head in some misguided attempt at ideological purity. [1] https://www.macrumors.com/2017/07/20/apple-talks-australian-government-encryption/ https://www.macrumors.com/2017/07/20/apple-talks-australian-...

riffraff 9y ago
> rule of law prevails well, according to the post, they are actually complying with the law even now. The law might suck, but it's the law.
- aphextron 9y ago
  There's a big difference between "rule of law" and "rule by law"

veidr 9y ago

Speak for yourself, dude. I would say "no". Tons of us would say "no". There are various things on this spectrum that any business can choose to do, or not do: use child labor, use political prison labor, dump toxic waste in public streams and rivers (after funding lobbyists to make it legal), etc.

gthbdk 9y ago
Another hard 'no' here. There's a even strong chance I'd actively hamper company operations surrounding the project, and bust out psychological warfare on management until fired.
- justadeveloper2 9y ago
  Me too. The point about Apple is that they are abetting human rights violations. The Chinese treat their people like animals.
  - saimiam 9y ago
    This is just crazy talk @ The Chinese treat their people like animals. Millions lifted out of poverty. Nationalistic fervor. Chinese tourists traveling abroad (shows affluence.) I'm no China apologist but we could do with less grandstanding overall.
  - zhte415 9y ago
    >The Chinese treat their people like animals. The Chinese are the People, that's the point. Socialism. That's the definition of socialism. The way you phrase 'The Chinese treat their people' is what socialism exists to fight against... or that's the ideological angle... You cannot confuse nation, nationality, and identity for mainland China. They're rolled into one, which is perfect for the current hegemony.
kryptiskt 9y ago
Even simpler, they could just allow sideloading of apps so they don't have to be the gatekeeper defending China's interests.

pjmlp 9y ago

Actually those silly trainings that most of us have to do at companies of similar size about company culture say exactly that, that it is preferable to lose a business than do immoral stuff. Of course no one takes them seriously, because the actual reality on the field is that nothing other than profits matter.

justadeveloper2 9y ago

Oh, I see, they only take on "moral" issues when it comes to the US elections? Companies like Apple, Google, and Facebook can sway the world right into totalitarianism via their support of censorship and disregard for basic human rights. If these companies do side with the least common denominator, where does that leave the rest of us?

jpatokal 9y ago
Google does not censor search results in China and consequently remains largely blocked there to this day.