5 ms·

It absolutely did not. The girl made it clear that she doesn't have a credit card and can't/won't convince her parents to pay, so there's no way he would have

It absolutely did not. The girl made it clear that she doesn't have a credit card and can't/won't convince her parents to pay, so there's no way he would have gotten a sale out of her.

peterwwillis 16y ago
so he should subpoena the website for logs of every person she traded his music to and ask them all if they all have the same convenient lack of ability to pay $3.99 online? get real. one person shares with 10, those 10 with 100, and whoops, now he's lost over $400 in potential sales because she wanted to be nice and share. no i can not prove he would have had these sales, nor do i need to. you also seem to ignore his other suggestion: check out the song book at the library.
- chc 16y ago
  Your logic falls apart at the end. Checking out books from a library must be equally wrong. Hundreds of people can do it, and then he's out over a thousand dollars in potential sales.
  - peterwwillis 16y ago
    the books are returned, thus as long as the people do not make copies of the books all they can hope to do is memorize the sheet music. if they forget they have to go get it again. if it's already lent out, they have to buy it.
- mquander 16y ago
  Well, your first suggestion is as equally impossible to carry out as the actual law. I think you have to prove that the sales are lost, if you're making the case that someone is being harmed by piracy. Based on my experience with a ton of friends stealing media left and right, piracy seems somewhat orthogonal to sales. Folks seem to mostly steal things that are either very hard to get otherwise (old, out-of-print, not yet released) or that they would never be willing to pay for. A lot of pirates end up amassing a tremendous amount of media, more than they could ever afford if they were to buy it all. Often they spend a lot of money buying what they can afford. To complete this rehashed discussion with a repetitive anecdote, I can say with total certainty that I have spent literally thousands of dollars more on music than I would have ever spent if I did not steal any. Like the girl in the article, I was a teenager with no capacity to pay for music for years as I discovered and stole from all the artists from whom I have been buying since.
  - loewenskind 16y ago
    I think you're confusing some issues here. In the case of copyright infringement it is clear that sales were lost. The question is just how many and that is what can't be proven. It's true that numbers the media industry claims are ridiculous when compared against their projected growth before file-sharing took up widespread use but that doesn't mean their loss was $0 either.

It absolutely did not. The girl made it clear that she doesn't have a credit card and can't/won't convince her parents to pay, so there's no way he would have gotten a sale out of her.

peterwwillis 16y ago

so he should subpoena the website for logs of every person she traded his music to and ask them all if they all have the same convenient lack of ability to pay $3.99 online? get real. one person shares with 10, those 10 with 100, and whoops, now he's lost over $400 in potential sales because she wanted to be nice and share. no i can not prove he would have had these sales, nor do i need to. you also seem to ignore his other suggestion: check out the song book at the library.

chc 16y ago
Your logic falls apart at the end. Checking out books from a library must be equally wrong. Hundreds of people can do it, and then he's out over a thousand dollars in potential sales.
- peterwwillis 16y ago
  the books are returned, thus as long as the people do not make copies of the books all they can hope to do is memorize the sheet music. if they forget they have to go get it again. if it's already lent out, they have to buy it.
mquander 16y ago
Well, your first suggestion is as equally impossible to carry out as the actual law. I think you have to prove that the sales are lost, if you're making the case that someone is being harmed by piracy. Based on my experience with a ton of friends stealing media left and right, piracy seems somewhat orthogonal to sales. Folks seem to mostly steal things that are either very hard to get otherwise (old, out-of-print, not yet released) or that they would never be willing to pay for. A lot of pirates end up amassing a tremendous amount of media, more than they could ever afford if they were to buy it all. Often they spend a lot of money buying what they can afford. To complete this rehashed discussion with a repetitive anecdote, I can say with total certainty that I have spent literally thousands of dollars more on music than I would have ever spent if I did not steal any. Like the girl in the article, I was a teenager with no capacity to pay for music for years as I discovered and stole from all the artists from whom I have been buying since.
- loewenskind 16y ago
  I think you're confusing some issues here. In the case of copyright infringement it is clear that sales were lost. The question is just how many and that is what can't be proven. It's true that numbers the media industry claims are ridiculous when compared against their projected growth before file-sharing took up widespread use but that doesn't mean their loss was $0 either.