5 ms·

Question: Will people tire of Dystopian? Does anyone out there think there is a market for Utopian literature? Speculating how we can fix and improve things?

by taheca 9y ago

TeMPOraL 9y ago
I hope there is. I'm definitely interested; in fact, I'm actively seeking out positive, hopeful sci-fi now.
- rfrank 9y ago
  Island, by Huxley "Will Farnaby is a cynical journalist shipwrecked on the fictional island of Pala, a Buddhist paradise where modern science and technology is embraced only insofar as it can improve medicine and nutrition, not for industrialization; drugs are used for enlightenment, not for pacification; and the evils of corporatism are unknown." "The final novel from Aldous Huxley, Island is a provocative counterpoint to his worldwide classic Brave New World, in which a flourishing, ideal society located on a remote Pacific island attracts the envy of the outside world." https://www.amazon.com/Island-Aldous-Huxley/dp/0061561797 https://www.amazon.com/Island-Aldous-Huxley/dp/0061561797
pavel_lishin 9y ago
Those books exist. Daemon and FreedomTM are one pair of books that might be right up your alley. The Culture series describes what is arguably the best possible science fiction society to live in. Player of Games is a good introduction to the series, which shows off what the Culture is by taking you, in the shoes of one of its denizens, to a place that's a high contrast. David Brin always preaches scifi optimism, but I found Existence to be kind of a slog, so I never finished it - I think you'd agree with a lot of his writing, though. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6665847-daemon https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6665847-daemon https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/18630.The_Player_of_Games https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/18630.The_Player_of_Game... https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13039884-existence https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13039884-existence
- cpeterso 9y ago
  Iain Banks said he wrote The Culture series as a response to the authoritarian military science fiction of the 1960s. While not exactly utopian (The Culture is rather imperialistic), the books show a positive possible future. Banks's writing reminds me a bit of Douglas Adams' Hitchhikers Guide.
  - cpeterso 9y ago
    On further thought, "imperialistic" is not the right word. The Culture doesn't colonize other peoples, but Contact and Special Circumstances are definitely meddlesome.
tnecniv 9y ago
Utopian literature has a fundamental problem where there is no conflict...because it's a Utopia. The only popular utopian literature I can think of is Star Trek and all of their plots either involve characters leaving the utopia to explore or defending it from those who would destroy it.
- mch82 9y ago
  Interesting comments on the Star Trek plots... sort of like Tsun Tsu's Art of War concept that people need dystopia to recognize utopia.
- mch82 9y ago
  You've really hit on the key point: dystopia is a source of drama in storytelling. It's (at least to me) much more challenging to tell an engaging story set in a utopian world. If anyone has tips for utopian story telling please share...
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  Utopian literature typically uses conflict with a non-utopian society both because it drives drama/interest and because it provides a context (especially where the non-utopian society is familiar to the intended audience) for illustrating the contrast between what is proposed and the status quo. A classical form of this conflict is the form of the interaction of a member (or group of members) of the non-utopian society (especially one with a strong pre-existing bias against the utopian society) thrust into the utopian society. Typically, the outsider is converted (if single; if there a multiple, the response is often that most convert, but having a minority of unconvinced holdouts isn't uncommon.) Among others Walden Two and Ecotopia use variations of this.
mjevans 9y ago
I think I'll try to talk about two sub-classes of distopian fiction across any media of presentation (texts, art, AV works, interactive media (games)). * A happy ending: Things were going wrong, but there's at least one 'right' ending, where things go the way most would agree is positive. * Only 'bad' endings: There might be a fight, you might even win the battle, but ultimately the war is lost. I think that the popularity of each of these depends on how hopeful society in general (and the people consuming the works in specific) are about the future. If we feel like there's no control or only bad routes left then the works with only 'less bad' endings will probably win.
fullshark 9y ago
I definitely think there is a market for it, that's what I was hoping the new Star Trek series would be.

Question: Will people tire of Dystopian? Does anyone out there think there is a market for Utopian literature? Speculating how we can fix and improve things?

by taheca 9y ago

Question: Will people tire of Dystopian? Does anyone out there think there is a market for Utopian literature? Speculating how we can fix and improve things?

TeMPOraL 9y ago

I hope there is. I'm definitely interested; in fact, I'm actively seeking out positive, hopeful sci-fi now.

rfrank 9y ago
Island, by Huxley "Will Farnaby is a cynical journalist shipwrecked on the fictional island of Pala, a Buddhist paradise where modern science and technology is embraced only insofar as it can improve medicine and nutrition, not for industrialization; drugs are used for enlightenment, not for pacification; and the evils of corporatism are unknown." "The final novel from Aldous Huxley, Island is a provocative counterpoint to his worldwide classic Brave New World, in which a flourishing, ideal society located on a remote Pacific island attracts the envy of the outside world." https://www.amazon.com/Island-Aldous-Huxley/dp/0061561797 https://www.amazon.com/Island-Aldous-Huxley/dp/0061561797

pavel_lishin 9y ago

Those books exist. Daemon and FreedomTM are one pair of books that might be right up your alley. The Culture series describes what is arguably the best possible science fiction society to live in. Player of Games is a good introduction to the series, which shows off what the Culture is by taking you, in the shoes of one of its denizens, to a place that's a high contrast. David Brin always preaches scifi optimism, but I found Existence to be kind of a slog, so I never finished it - I think you'd agree with a lot of his writing, though. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6665847-daemon https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6665847-daemon https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/18630.The_Player_of_Games https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/18630.The_Player_of_Game... https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13039884-existence https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13039884-existence

cpeterso 9y ago
Iain Banks said he wrote The Culture series as a response to the authoritarian military science fiction of the 1960s. While not exactly utopian (The Culture is rather imperialistic), the books show a positive possible future. Banks's writing reminds me a bit of Douglas Adams' Hitchhikers Guide.
- cpeterso 9y ago
  On further thought, "imperialistic" is not the right word. The Culture doesn't colonize other peoples, but Contact and Special Circumstances are definitely meddlesome.

tnecniv 9y ago

Utopian literature has a fundamental problem where there is no conflict...because it's a Utopia. The only popular utopian literature I can think of is Star Trek and all of their plots either involve characters leaving the utopia to explore or defending it from those who would destroy it.

mch82 9y ago
Interesting comments on the Star Trek plots... sort of like Tsun Tsu's Art of War concept that people need dystopia to recognize utopia.
mch82 9y ago
You've really hit on the key point: dystopia is a source of drama in storytelling. It's (at least to me) much more challenging to tell an engaging story set in a utopian world. If anyone has tips for utopian story telling please share...
dragonwriter 9y ago
Utopian literature typically uses conflict with a non-utopian society both because it drives drama/interest and because it provides a context (especially where the non-utopian society is familiar to the intended audience) for illustrating the contrast between what is proposed and the status quo. A classical form of this conflict is the form of the interaction of a member (or group of members) of the non-utopian society (especially one with a strong pre-existing bias against the utopian society) thrust into the utopian society. Typically, the outsider is converted (if single; if there a multiple, the response is often that most convert, but having a minority of unconvinced holdouts isn't uncommon.) Among others Walden Two and Ecotopia use variations of this.

mjevans 9y ago

I think I'll try to talk about two sub-classes of distopian fiction across any media of presentation (texts, art, AV works, interactive media (games)). * A happy ending: Things were going wrong, but there's at least one 'right' ending, where things go the way most would agree is positive. * Only 'bad' endings: There might be a fight, you might even win the battle, but ultimately the war is lost. I think that the popularity of each of these depends on how hopeful society in general (and the people consuming the works in specific) are about the future. If we feel like there's no control or only bad routes left then the works with only 'less bad' endings will probably win.

fullshark 9y ago

I definitely think there is a market for it, that's what I was hoping the new Star Trek series would be.