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It always stuns me to hear so many people blaming NIMBY movements for housing prices while completely ignoring the effect that good job concentration has on the

It always stuns me to hear so many people blaming NIMBY movements for housing prices while completely ignoring the effect that good job concentration has on the local housing markets. Housing is insanely expensive on the east and west coast because those are the only areas of the country seeing economic growth. If everyone is required to be in such a small area to even have an opportunity to get a good job, then of course it will be expensive to live there.

asabjorn 9y ago
That is because we on the west coast have zoned most neighborhoods to single family housing, and that is a direct cause of our housing supply constraint and therefore our high housing cost. It would be trivial to replace a fraction of that housing with enough housing to meet demand if we rezoned.
- surveilmebro 9y ago
  It is a direct cause, but not the only cause. The fact that virtually all job growth is in these cities is equally if not more to blame. As a Seattle resident who was priced out of a succession of neighborhoods through grad school, I can't help but wonder why we need so much growth. It's not like there's a shortage of employment opportunities.
epistasis 9y ago
The NIMBY problem prevents the housing market from adapting to demand, it's entirety of the problem. Job growth and economic growth are not the problems. In places such as Texas with high economic growth housing is not a problem. It just so happens that NIMBYs have huge economic gains from restricting the market from supplying what people want.
angersock 9y ago
> because those are the only areas of the country seeing economic growth. [citation needed]
- TheAdamAndChe 9y ago
  https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/02/this-map-will-change-the-way-you-see-the-us-economy/ https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/02/this-map-will-change-... https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/11/cities-economic-fates-diverge/417372/ https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/11/cities-... http://www.economist.com/node/18332880 http://www.economist.com/node/18332880
  - angersock 9y ago
    Yeah, both Chicago and Houston look like they're doing pretty well, so maybe it's not just the coasts...?
cestith 9y ago
Perhaps you'd like to hear about a little-known, tiny little state named "Texas".
- seanp2k2 9y ago
  How is the tech job market there, especially outside of Austin, which also has skyrocketing rent? https://www.rentjungle.com/average-rent-in-austin-rent-trends/ https://www.rentjungle.com/average-rent-in-austin-rent-trend...
  - drivingmenuts 9y ago
    Dallas and Houston have a tech job market, but those are the only other serious locations. They're also not really startup markets, like Austin.
    - larrydag 9y ago
      There are plenty of startups in TX but not in the traditional Silicon Valley definition. There are a lot of startups in oil & gas, transportation, banking, retail to name a few.
  - scythe 9y ago
    I've heard good things about San Antonio, but I don't know the specifics. Texas is just too hot and dry for me to live there, though, so if it suits you good luck
    - runamok 9y ago
      If you don't like dry, Houston is for you! ;-) It is one of the few places I know of where humidity can be 100% and it not rain...
  - cestith 9y ago
    I'm in Houston personally. My employer is always hiring. I'm several times a week contacted by recruiters for jobs in Houston, Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Chicago, Kansas City, and Denver. None of those are on the east nor west coast.
closeparen 9y ago
But why is the job growth there? I'd say it's because our postwar experiment with living far away from each other failed. It was a bad idea and it created spaces that were unpleasant to live in. Those of us who were born in such places, and have a choice in the matter, are getting out. Certain skills are in high enough demand that people with those skills get to choose where to live. We choose places that don't look and feel like crap. We choose places that lots of other people choose. This makes them expensive. The arc of human history is towards urbanization, and those of us with in-demand skills are its primary agents simply because we have the most choice in the matter of where to live. Of course it doesn't help that the places we choose believe they are already full. I just watched this and it was electrifying: https://www.ted.com/talks/james_howard_kunstler_dissects_suburbia https://www.ted.com/talks/james_howard_kunstler_dissects_sub...

asabjorn 9y ago

That is because we on the west coast have zoned most neighborhoods to single family housing, and that is a direct cause of our housing supply constraint and therefore our high housing cost. It would be trivial to replace a fraction of that housing with enough housing to meet demand if we rezoned.

surveilmebro 9y ago
It is a direct cause, but not the only cause. The fact that virtually all job growth is in these cities is equally if not more to blame. As a Seattle resident who was priced out of a succession of neighborhoods through grad school, I can't help but wonder why we need so much growth. It's not like there's a shortage of employment opportunities.

epistasis 9y ago

The NIMBY problem prevents the housing market from adapting to demand, it's entirety of the problem. Job growth and economic growth are not the problems. In places such as Texas with high economic growth housing is not a problem. It just so happens that NIMBYs have huge economic gains from restricting the market from supplying what people want.

angersock 9y ago

> because those are the only areas of the country seeing economic growth. [citation needed]

TheAdamAndChe 9y ago
https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/02/this-map-will-change-the-way-you-see-the-us-economy/ https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2016/02/this-map-will-change-... https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/11/cities-economic-fates-diverge/417372/ https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/11/cities-... http://www.economist.com/node/18332880 http://www.economist.com/node/18332880
- angersock 9y ago
  Yeah, both Chicago and Houston look like they're doing pretty well, so maybe it's not just the coasts...?

cestith 9y ago

Perhaps you'd like to hear about a little-known, tiny little state named "Texas".

seanp2k2 9y ago
How is the tech job market there, especially outside of Austin, which also has skyrocketing rent? https://www.rentjungle.com/average-rent-in-austin-rent-trends/ https://www.rentjungle.com/average-rent-in-austin-rent-trend...
- drivingmenuts 9y ago
  Dallas and Houston have a tech job market, but those are the only other serious locations. They're also not really startup markets, like Austin.
  - larrydag 9y ago
    There are plenty of startups in TX but not in the traditional Silicon Valley definition. There are a lot of startups in oil & gas, transportation, banking, retail to name a few.
- scythe 9y ago
  I've heard good things about San Antonio, but I don't know the specifics. Texas is just too hot and dry for me to live there, though, so if it suits you good luck
  - runamok 9y ago
    If you don't like dry, Houston is for you! ;-) It is one of the few places I know of where humidity can be 100% and it not rain...
- cestith 9y ago
  I'm in Houston personally. My employer is always hiring. I'm several times a week contacted by recruiters for jobs in Houston, Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Chicago, Kansas City, and Denver. None of those are on the east nor west coast.

closeparen 9y ago

But why is the job growth there? I'd say it's because our postwar experiment with living far away from each other failed. It was a bad idea and it created spaces that were unpleasant to live in. Those of us who were born in such places, and have a choice in the matter, are getting out. Certain skills are in high enough demand that people with those skills get to choose where to live. We choose places that don't look and feel like crap. We choose places that lots of other people choose. This makes them expensive. The arc of human history is towards urbanization, and those of us with in-demand skills are its primary agents simply because we have the most choice in the matter of where to live. Of course it doesn't help that the places we choose believe they are already full. I just watched this and it was electrifying: https://www.ted.com/talks/james_howard_kunstler_dissects_suburbia https://www.ted.com/talks/james_howard_kunstler_dissects_sub...