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At the high end, there are no substitute US citizens. Imagine trying to find an American-born replacement for Yann LeCun. At the low end, the H1B abuse train de

by qq66 9y ago

At the high end, there are no substitute US citizens. Imagine trying to find an American-born replacement for Yann LeCun. At the low end, the H1B abuse train definitely imports a lot of people with close to zero skills.

marcell 9y ago
> At the high end, there are no substitute US citizens. What? Many brilliant engineers were born outside the US, including one of the founders of Google, Sergey Brin.
- outworlder 9y ago
  "No substitute US citizens" not "No substitute FOR US citizens"
- gumby 9y ago
  I misread that at first too, writer means: there is no US citizen who can replace certain people.
Melanie_ 9y ago
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bilbo0s 9y ago
"....At the high end, there are no substitute US citizens....." This can't be overstated enough. I think the immigration that is critical to the US is the high end immigration, not the low end stuff like H1B. I'm just afraid that the chanting mobs will want to throw the baby out with the bath water. We NEED the NIW-types, we don't really need most of the H1B-types. So if the political environment is such that we need to cut loose some H1B-types to save the NIW-types... we should do so without hesitation.
- gumby 9y ago
  Those "High end" people come in on H1s as well!
  - bilbo0s 9y ago
    H1s are not even on the same field of play as NIWs... there really is just no comparison. That's why it's called a (N)ational (I)nterests (W)aiver. Because everyone from the commerce department, to the congress, to the military and intelligence people all agree that we need that guy's brainpower. Or more precisely... they all agree that we need to deny that guy's brainpower to every other nation on earth if possible.
    - gumby 9y ago
      That's an immigrant visa, not a working visa. The question was working visas someone like Lecun whom I'm pretty certain showed up here first on an H1-B.
  - qq66 9y ago
    Yes, of course they do. The H1B program is critical for American competitiveness.
- geebee 9y ago
  What would you estimate as a minimum salary level for your definition of "high end?" To me, since these workers tend to have grad degrees and are very talented, I'd peg it to a fairly high level law, medical, business, or finance worker. In short, anything less than $250k a year would get you laughed out of the building, and we're probably looking at $400k ore more. I'm not sure what the percentages are here, but yeah, like you'd I'd guess that the percentage of H1Bs at these salary levels is very low. In short, if the H1B visa were limited to these sorts of workers, my guess is there would be no real discussion or controversy about the program. Kind of astonishing that we award these by lottery. The whole system is really bad. Then again, it is used cynically by people who defend the program (they trot out the small percentage of very highly paid people and say "what you don't want this guy working in the US?", as if that is the issue or is in any way representative of 97% of the use of the program).

by qq66 9y ago

marcell 9y ago

> At the high end, there are no substitute US citizens. What? Many brilliant engineers were born outside the US, including one of the founders of Google, Sergey Brin.

outworlder 9y ago
"No substitute US citizens" not "No substitute FOR US citizens"
gumby 9y ago
I misread that at first too, writer means: there is no US citizen who can replace certain people.

Melanie_ 9y ago

I'm making $86 an hour working from home. I was shocked when my neighbour told me she was averaging $95 but I see how it works now. I feel so much freedom now that I'm my own boss. This is what I do, ========http://www.smartfinancemedia.com/?682 http://www.smartfinancemedia.com/?682

bilbo0s 9y ago

"....At the high end, there are no substitute US citizens....." This can't be overstated enough. I think the immigration that is critical to the US is the high end immigration, not the low end stuff like H1B. I'm just afraid that the chanting mobs will want to throw the baby out with the bath water. We NEED the NIW-types, we don't really need most of the H1B-types. So if the political environment is such that we need to cut loose some H1B-types to save the NIW-types... we should do so without hesitation.

gumby 9y ago
Those "High end" people come in on H1s as well!
- bilbo0s 9y ago
  H1s are not even on the same field of play as NIWs... there really is just no comparison. That's why it's called a (N)ational (I)nterests (W)aiver. Because everyone from the commerce department, to the congress, to the military and intelligence people all agree that we need that guy's brainpower. Or more precisely... they all agree that we need to deny that guy's brainpower to every other nation on earth if possible.
  - gumby 9y ago
    That's an immigrant visa, not a working visa. The question was working visas someone like Lecun whom I'm pretty certain showed up here first on an H1-B.
- qq66 9y ago
  Yes, of course they do. The H1B program is critical for American competitiveness.
geebee 9y ago
What would you estimate as a minimum salary level for your definition of "high end?" To me, since these workers tend to have grad degrees and are very talented, I'd peg it to a fairly high level law, medical, business, or finance worker. In short, anything less than $250k a year would get you laughed out of the building, and we're probably looking at $400k ore more. I'm not sure what the percentages are here, but yeah, like you'd I'd guess that the percentage of H1Bs at these salary levels is very low. In short, if the H1B visa were limited to these sorts of workers, my guess is there would be no real discussion or controversy about the program. Kind of astonishing that we award these by lottery. The whole system is really bad. Then again, it is used cynically by people who defend the program (they trot out the small percentage of very highly paid people and say "what you don't want this guy working in the US?", as if that is the issue or is in any way representative of 97% of the use of the program).