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QoL in California is pretty poor, considering the cost required as compared to the rest of the US. Only immigrants are willing to pay the price since for many o

QoL in California is pretty poor, considering the cost required as compared to the rest of the US. Only immigrants are willing to pay the price since for many of them, it's still an upgrade from what they can get back home.

gumby 9y ago
> QoL in California is pretty poor, considering the cost required as compared to the rest of the US. After 30 years, on and off, in the valley I agree the QoL here isn't great (when compared to Germany, France, Australia...) but way way better than anywhere else in the US.
- strictnein 9y ago
  > After 30 years, on and off, in the valley I agree the QoL here isn't great (when compared to Germany, France, Australia...) but way way better than anywhere else in the US. No, it simply isn't. By any stretch of the imagination.
  - 0xffff2 9y ago
    By what definition? I've lived most of my life in California (split between the bay area and LA). I can't even begin to imagine being happier outside of California. Aside from rent, I see nothing at all that is better in other states I visit.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - sbov 9y ago
      Probably similar to yours: mostly subjective ones. I was born and raised in California and love it here. My older brother was born and raised in California, hated it, and loves it in North Carolina.
- pc86 9y ago
  This is just wrong. You may prefer the Bay Area, and I don't think anyone here is going to argue you shouldn't, but to say that the quality of life is better is just wrong. San Francisco is more than 3x more expensive than the metro I live in now. I'd need to earn $350k a year just to break even financially before taxes. I'd pay a lot more in federal income tax, and my state income tax is flat and in the low single digits. Call it $375k to break even on take home pay after paying for everything (rent, retirement, etc). How likely am I to make almost $400k a year? That's top 1% income nationally. That's IB money, not writing a CRUD app in JavaScript. Not to mention I go home for lunch and I have a 10-minute, 4-mile commute. And speaking of home, a constant pain point I hear from Bay Area programmers on HN is that they'll never be able to buy a home. San Francisco housing is over 1,200% (percent) more expensive than my area. My home cost a few thousand dollars more than I earn in a year. No thank you.
  - Veelox 9y ago
    What are you spending money on that you need to earn $350k to break even? Assuming you find a modest home in SF for $1mil your 30 year mortgage would be ~$57k a year. Property tax is ~$7k. Insurance will be <$5k. So to have a home you only need <70k. Assuming no deductions filing as a single you will pay ~$140k in taxes on $350k. This leaves you with (350-140-70) $140k a year in disposable income. So I repeat, what are you spending money on that you need to make $140k in disposable income to break even?
    - abc_lisper 9y ago
      You have to be very modest for that $1 mil. You would probably get a 900 sqft home :D
      - Veelox 9y ago
        You can find several. https://www.redfin.com/city/17151/CA/San-Francisco/filter/max-price=1M,min-beds=2,viewport=37.82379:37.69961:-122.32198:-122.53965 https://www.redfin.com/city/17151/CA/San-Francisco/filter/ma...
    - 9y ago
dragonwriter 9y ago
> QoL in California is pretty poor, considering the cost required as compared to the rest of the US That's certainly true for people outside of high-paying jobs (California has the highest, CoL-adjusted poverty rate in the nation), but less clearly so for those with high-paying work, who often are better off (even given local CoL) than they would be elsewhere because wages in elite fields are often higher here even compared to CoL.

gumby 9y ago

> QoL in California is pretty poor, considering the cost required as compared to the rest of the US. After 30 years, on and off, in the valley I agree the QoL here isn't great (when compared to Germany, France, Australia...) but way way better than anywhere else in the US.

strictnein 9y ago
> After 30 years, on and off, in the valley I agree the QoL here isn't great (when compared to Germany, France, Australia...) but way way better than anywhere else in the US. No, it simply isn't. By any stretch of the imagination.
- 0xffff2 9y ago
  By what definition? I've lived most of my life in California (split between the bay area and LA). I can't even begin to imagine being happier outside of California. Aside from rent, I see nothing at all that is better in other states I visit.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - sbov 9y ago
    Probably similar to yours: mostly subjective ones. I was born and raised in California and love it here. My older brother was born and raised in California, hated it, and loves it in North Carolina.
pc86 9y ago
This is just wrong. You may prefer the Bay Area, and I don't think anyone here is going to argue you shouldn't, but to say that the quality of life is better is just wrong. San Francisco is more than 3x more expensive than the metro I live in now. I'd need to earn $350k a year just to break even financially before taxes. I'd pay a lot more in federal income tax, and my state income tax is flat and in the low single digits. Call it $375k to break even on take home pay after paying for everything (rent, retirement, etc). How likely am I to make almost $400k a year? That's top 1% income nationally. That's IB money, not writing a CRUD app in JavaScript. Not to mention I go home for lunch and I have a 10-minute, 4-mile commute. And speaking of home, a constant pain point I hear from Bay Area programmers on HN is that they'll never be able to buy a home. San Francisco housing is over 1,200% (percent) more expensive than my area. My home cost a few thousand dollars more than I earn in a year. No thank you.
- Veelox 9y ago
  What are you spending money on that you need to earn $350k to break even? Assuming you find a modest home in SF for $1mil your 30 year mortgage would be ~$57k a year. Property tax is ~$7k. Insurance will be <$5k. So to have a home you only need <70k. Assuming no deductions filing as a single you will pay ~$140k in taxes on $350k. This leaves you with (350-140-70) $140k a year in disposable income. So I repeat, what are you spending money on that you need to make $140k in disposable income to break even?
  - abc_lisper 9y ago
    You have to be very modest for that $1 mil. You would probably get a 900 sqft home :D
    - Veelox 9y ago
      You can find several. https://www.redfin.com/city/17151/CA/San-Francisco/filter/max-price=1M,min-beds=2,viewport=37.82379:37.69961:-122.32198:-122.53965 https://www.redfin.com/city/17151/CA/San-Francisco/filter/ma...
  - 9y ago

dragonwriter 9y ago

> QoL in California is pretty poor, considering the cost required as compared to the rest of the US That's certainly true for people outside of high-paying jobs (California has the highest, CoL-adjusted poverty rate in the nation), but less clearly so for those with high-paying work, who often are better off (even given local CoL) than they would be elsewhere because wages in elite fields are often higher here even compared to CoL.