5 ms·

I was in the Windows CE space (the basis for Windows Phone 'til appx. Windows Phone 8) a bit when Windows CE was mostly killed; so sad to see the MS employee bl

by j_s 9y ago

I was in the Windows CE space (the basis for Windows Phone 'til appx. Windows Phone 8) a bit when Windows CE was mostly killed; so sad to see the MS employee blogs withering on the vine filled with comments from helpless developers as Microsoft kept moving the cheese. https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/obloch/2010/05/03/windows-ce-is-not-dead/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/obloch/2010/05/03/windows-c... https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/dotnet/2012/11/16/introducing-netcf-3-9-in-windows-embedded-compact-2013-a-faster-leaner-and-multi-core-runtime/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/dotnet/2012/11/16/introduci... https://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/details/595712/no-support-for-windows-ce-and-compact-framework-development-in-vs2010 https://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/details/... -- I blame Experiment 19: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/project/experiment-19/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/project/experiment-... The prototype proved that Windows NT and the CLR could deliver better performance than Windows CE and the .NET Compact Framework on identical hardware. Within months of the completion of Experiment 19, Microsoft launched efforts to build what would become Windows Phone 8 and Windows RT for ARM tablets.

ahmeni 9y ago
Windows CE will live on for the foreseeable future in the form of those terrible, terrible inventory scanguns.
- digi_owl 9y ago
  I thought most of those were being replaced by iphones in cases or docks...
  - ahmeni 9y ago
    Slowly but surely, yes. But definitely slow enough that there's still a significant amount of the Windows CE powered hardware around. Swapping the hardware is the easy part but integrating new components with your SAP powered warehouse (with custom things your $1k+/day SAP specialists have flown in and written and left undocumented) itself is generally a massive project.
guelo 9y ago
Yes. They lost in 2004-2007 when they decided to stop investing in the growing CE platform. I still don't understand why. It's got to be one of the biggest business blunders of all time.
- jmspring 9y ago
  Developing on WinCE in the early 2000s and developing on Windows based server apps at the same time was actually somewhat efficient. APIs had some consistencies between the platforms -- not mentioning shared toolsets. The WP7 -> WP8 thing was unforgivable.
- Const-me 9y ago
  > I still don't understand why. AFAIK, they wanted developers to use native code and Windows API. This is especially needed for games and other resource-demanding apps. Windows CE is just too old. The security there is comparable to Windows 9.x, i.e. almost no security. It was very hard to design a CE-based OS that would allow arbitrary native code to run, while denying the ability to access user’s private data and break the device. WP7 only allowed C++ code for close MS partners. Regular developers had to use .NET, which has its own very advanced security model built-in. Probably, MS thought that once they allow C++ development, third-party developers start to port their older Windows games to WP 8 + Direct3D 11 feature level 9.3. Eventually the plan didn’t work. MS bought Minecraft, convinced Rockstar to port GTA San Andreas, but the platform still hadn’t gain enough traction, and most third party developers passed.
- heisenbit 9y ago
  > I still don't understand why. Look at Apple and compare the iPhone and Mac versions. They share the same architecture and a lot of code and that is not just on the surface but for real. This allows Apple to have one very, very good codebase for their OS. Microsoft did not have that solid foundation and additional challenges particularly in the area of security. There was no way for them to catch up if they maintained multiple platforms. To see where trying to have multiple platforms lead just study Nokia.

by j_s 9y ago

ahmeni 9y ago

Windows CE will live on for the foreseeable future in the form of those terrible, terrible inventory scanguns.

digi_owl 9y ago
I thought most of those were being replaced by iphones in cases or docks...
- ahmeni 9y ago
  Slowly but surely, yes. But definitely slow enough that there's still a significant amount of the Windows CE powered hardware around. Swapping the hardware is the easy part but integrating new components with your SAP powered warehouse (with custom things your $1k+/day SAP specialists have flown in and written and left undocumented) itself is generally a massive project.

guelo 9y ago

Yes. They lost in 2004-2007 when they decided to stop investing in the growing CE platform. I still don't understand why. It's got to be one of the biggest business blunders of all time.

jmspring 9y ago
Developing on WinCE in the early 2000s and developing on Windows based server apps at the same time was actually somewhat efficient. APIs had some consistencies between the platforms -- not mentioning shared toolsets. The WP7 -> WP8 thing was unforgivable.
Const-me 9y ago
> I still don't understand why. AFAIK, they wanted developers to use native code and Windows API. This is especially needed for games and other resource-demanding apps. Windows CE is just too old. The security there is comparable to Windows 9.x, i.e. almost no security. It was very hard to design a CE-based OS that would allow arbitrary native code to run, while denying the ability to access user’s private data and break the device. WP7 only allowed C++ code for close MS partners. Regular developers had to use .NET, which has its own very advanced security model built-in. Probably, MS thought that once they allow C++ development, third-party developers start to port their older Windows games to WP 8 + Direct3D 11 feature level 9.3. Eventually the plan didn’t work. MS bought Minecraft, convinced Rockstar to port GTA San Andreas, but the platform still hadn’t gain enough traction, and most third party developers passed.
heisenbit 9y ago
> I still don't understand why. Look at Apple and compare the iPhone and Mac versions. They share the same architecture and a lot of code and that is not just on the surface but for real. This allows Apple to have one very, very good codebase for their OS. Microsoft did not have that solid foundation and additional challenges particularly in the area of security. There was no way for them to catch up if they maintained multiple platforms. To see where trying to have multiple platforms lead just study Nokia.