24 ms·

Its their country and their laws, trying to solve the problem of Islamic extremism on their own. In western countries, you get detained for years in Guantanamo

Its their country and their laws, trying to solve the problem of Islamic extremism on their own. In western countries, you get detained for years in Guantanamo under torture without knowing for sure why you got arrested. Young girls get married as early as 12 to creepy old dudes and there is no need to ask for installing spyware because the phones and communications are already tapped by default. Anyone criticizing China while permitting their own country to do worse is an hypocrite. Still waiting for the outrage about the mass surveillance from Amazon Echo, Google and others. Only the European Commission is doing something visible against this trend.

eivarv 9y ago
Yes, but a hypocrite can still be right.
- jack9 9y ago
  If you think there's a right and wrong, a hypocrite is usually right in either deed or stated intent...
  - eivarv 9y ago
    I didn't mean "right" in a moral sense, or even correct. Being a hypocrite is irrelevant with regard to what the hypocrite is saying.
CrazyHumanist 9y ago
This kind of appeasement, the idea of minding only the business of your own country, seems a bit indefensible to me. And you cannot determine if one is a hypocrite just from a fact, there's no outrage, or can you? Many solves this problem their way, pointing out, talking about it, criticizing it and so forth.
- nunobrito 9y ago
  When aptly criticizing another government as authoritarian and harassing a minority, while having their own government doing worse to the said minority, this can be seen by others as: a) exceptionalism (double standards) b) cognitive dissonance c) hypocrisy There is no higher moral ground on this situation so option c) would be suited. It is great when we strive to get better human rights for everyone, and yet the human rights for the citizens of another country are being threatened by religious extremists. How the government of this other country replies is really their own business whether we like it or not. Is it a mass violation of human rights? Perhaps. What made them reach such decision? We don't know either. Are we in the west doing any better? No. China is not bombing Syria nor toppling moderate Islamic governments in North Africa. This bad situation won't charge in our own turf while the majority of netizens think that this only happens in other turfs.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
snuxoll 9y ago
I'm not happy with Gitmo either or the NSA's bullshit. Privacy and human rights violations like this by any government need to be stopped, every day it feels like we are treading closer to 1984 across the globe.
em3rgent0rdr 9y ago
> "Islamic extremism" In Xinjiang region, the concern is more about separatism, which is not terrorism, and which should be a right of any group. > "Anyone criticizing China while permitting their own country to do worse is an hypocrite" One can be critical of their own government while still being critical of others. Even in US, ordinary people don't have much control over the government, in particular over the security state, other than complaining, so "permitting" abuses shouldn't be considered hypocritical.
- mustbesatire 9y ago
  >In Xinjiang region, the concern is more about separatism, which is not terrorism, and which should be a right of any group. So much this. This is about bigoted Christian males(likely shadow-whites behind the Chinese Christian leadership), trying to force their religious dogma on the muslim population.
- nunobrito 9y ago
  Islamic extremism is deeply connected to separatism. That's what the "Islamic State" is all about. You can surely be critical of others, your own government does comparably worse to the same minority without even letting ordinary people know. That is hypocrisy.
  - em3rgent0rdr 9y ago
    extremism != separatism.
  - 0xcde4c3db 9y ago
    Separatism implies that something else exists to be separate from. ISIL has declared that all other states are illegitimate and are to be replaced by a "worldwide caliphate".
  - dionian 9y ago
    "Islamic extremism" is a nebulous category that can be ascribed to ANY socio-political unrest of peoples who happen to live in a predominantly muslim area. What do they call extremism in other areas with deep socioeconomic problems? Non-islamic extremism?
nkassis 9y ago
"Anyone criticizing China while permitting their own country to do worse is an hypocrite." Ridiculous statement. "Permitting", like it's my choice? You can live in a country and disagree with some of what it does. Even better in democracies where you can do so publicly and have some form of impact through voting. Also happy I'm able to discuss this topic online without this post getting blocked/deleted and facing possible repercussions. "Still waiting for the outrage about the mass surveillance from Amazon Echo, Google and others" Yes like that debate doesn't exist and no one talks about it?
- paradite 9y ago
  But https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cluster=17954365954889690506&hl=en&as_sdt=0,5&sciodt=0,5 https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cluster=17954365954889690...

eivarv 9y ago

Yes, but a hypocrite can still be right.

jack9 9y ago
If you think there's a right and wrong, a hypocrite is usually right in either deed or stated intent...
- eivarv 9y ago
  I didn't mean "right" in a moral sense, or even correct. Being a hypocrite is irrelevant with regard to what the hypocrite is saying.

CrazyHumanist 9y ago

This kind of appeasement, the idea of minding only the business of your own country, seems a bit indefensible to me. And you cannot determine if one is a hypocrite just from a fact, there's no outrage, or can you? Many solves this problem their way, pointing out, talking about it, criticizing it and so forth.

nunobrito 9y ago
When aptly criticizing another government as authoritarian and harassing a minority, while having their own government doing worse to the said minority, this can be seen by others as: a) exceptionalism (double standards) b) cognitive dissonance c) hypocrisy There is no higher moral ground on this situation so option c) would be suited. It is great when we strive to get better human rights for everyone, and yet the human rights for the citizens of another country are being threatened by religious extremists. How the government of this other country replies is really their own business whether we like it or not. Is it a mass violation of human rights? Perhaps. What made them reach such decision? We don't know either. Are we in the west doing any better? No. China is not bombing Syria nor toppling moderate Islamic governments in North Africa. This bad situation won't charge in our own turf while the majority of netizens think that this only happens in other turfs.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

snuxoll 9y ago

I'm not happy with Gitmo either or the NSA's bullshit. Privacy and human rights violations like this by any government need to be stopped, every day it feels like we are treading closer to 1984 across the globe.

em3rgent0rdr 9y ago

> "Islamic extremism" In Xinjiang region, the concern is more about separatism, which is not terrorism, and which should be a right of any group. > "Anyone criticizing China while permitting their own country to do worse is an hypocrite" One can be critical of their own government while still being critical of others. Even in US, ordinary people don't have much control over the government, in particular over the security state, other than complaining, so "permitting" abuses shouldn't be considered hypocritical.

mustbesatire 9y ago
>In Xinjiang region, the concern is more about separatism, which is not terrorism, and which should be a right of any group. So much this. This is about bigoted Christian males(likely shadow-whites behind the Chinese Christian leadership), trying to force their religious dogma on the muslim population.
nunobrito 9y ago
Islamic extremism is deeply connected to separatism. That's what the "Islamic State" is all about. You can surely be critical of others, your own government does comparably worse to the same minority without even letting ordinary people know. That is hypocrisy.
- em3rgent0rdr 9y ago
  extremism != separatism.
- 0xcde4c3db 9y ago
  Separatism implies that something else exists to be separate from. ISIL has declared that all other states are illegitimate and are to be replaced by a "worldwide caliphate".
- dionian 9y ago
  "Islamic extremism" is a nebulous category that can be ascribed to ANY socio-political unrest of peoples who happen to live in a predominantly muslim area. What do they call extremism in other areas with deep socioeconomic problems? Non-islamic extremism?

nkassis 9y ago

"Anyone criticizing China while permitting their own country to do worse is an hypocrite." Ridiculous statement. "Permitting", like it's my choice? You can live in a country and disagree with some of what it does. Even better in democracies where you can do so publicly and have some form of impact through voting. Also happy I'm able to discuss this topic online without this post getting blocked/deleted and facing possible repercussions. "Still waiting for the outrage about the mass surveillance from Amazon Echo, Google and others" Yes like that debate doesn't exist and no one talks about it?

paradite 9y ago
But https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cluster=17954365954889690506&hl=en&as_sdt=0,5&sciodt=0,5 https://scholar.google.com/scholar?cluster=17954365954889690...