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I hate the fact that if I voice anything skeptical of this policy someone will call me a terrorist sympathizer. I'm of the conviction that the idea of blowing y

I hate the fact that if I voice anything skeptical of this policy someone will call me a terrorist sympathizer. I'm of the conviction that the idea of blowing yourself up is bad enough that we don't really need to censor it. Furthermore I've noticed that the public largely stops thinking the moment "terrorists" or "ISIS" is mentioned. We now live in a state where we can't move ~5000 USD without informing the government because "anti-terrorism money laundering laws". We can't mail certain food products into the US because "bio terrorism act of 2003". Our FBI wants to back door encryption because "ISIS". Notice a pattern yet? Will it stop with ISIS? Once the precedent is set how long will it be before other search results are manipulated for political reason? And its not like there's any side of the political spectrum I can vote for. Both Hillary and Trump wanted to censor extremism on Twitter. Both wanted to expand the no-fly list into a no-buy-guns list (constitutional implications be damned). Left, right, center and abroad the civil libertarian is under siege.

dangero 9y ago
The other day I was considering commenting in a negative way about something the NSA tweeted, but a voice in my head said, "Do you really want to be put on a special surveilance list?" That's when I realized our freedoms are under threat by those that are tasked with defending them. Think what you will about the NSA, but they certainly have not gone out of their way to make clear to me they care about my freedoms. Lying to congress, private courts granting warrants via secret constitution interpretations -- something is very wrong here. I fear the NSA as an upstanding citizen and they seem to be OK with that. Also more related to your comment the "don't watch ISIS videos it gives them power." I think it's misguided. Just out of curiousity I tracked down a couple of them online and it was very thought provoking. It did not make me fear ISIS more, but it did help me understand the situation more. Just not convinced intelligent people should avoid uncensored information collection, but there is so much being censored in the US right now and the media encourages you to not educate yourself on both sides.
- nerdponx 9y ago
  +1 for watching ISIS videos. I needed to understand the situation, I needed to internalize it better. I watched an execution. I watched combat footage. And I am glad I did. I now understand the severity and urgency of the problem. I didn't use a VPN or anything. NSA, come get me.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
- abhi3 9y ago
  >Also more related to your comment the "don't watch ISIS videos it gives them power." I think it's misguided. Just out of curiousity I tracked down a couple of them online and it was very thought provoking. It did not make me fear ISIS more, but it did help me understand the situation more. Just not convinced intelligent people should avoid uncensored information collection I think there has to be a better way to educate oneself/understand the situation than to watch terrorist propaganda. ISIS does not create videos 'to help people understand the situation more' but to radicalize suspectible people into becoming terrorists
  - dangero 9y ago
    Anything else would be second hand though. Sometimes I feel the need to research something for myself and it's important that some people do that. Watching allows me to answer questions like, "What is the message they are trying to get across in these videos?" "Do the videos match up to the descriptions given by the media?" These are important questions to answer.
alextheparrot 9y ago
I get your point - we've slowly, and sometimes quite quickly, seen some of our rights eroded as a result of policies that are advertised as being anti-terrorist. Speaking directly to this policy, though, isn't your man premise that blow oneself up is bad enough in a vacuum unsupported? Many of these videos are crafted by the terrorist organizations as a recruitment tool. Wouldn't th see organizations not create them if they didn't wield at least some power to actually recruit or radicalize? I don't think arguing that line is consistent, even if I agree that we shouldn't censor these videos.
- Retric 9y ago
  99.9999% of people don't blow themselves up. It's not a significant issue because it's such a bad idea. Don't get me wrong lightning strikes are also a non issue, but that does not make swimming in a thunder storm a good idea. Basic airport screening is useful, but you very quickly hit diminishing returns.
- megous 9y ago
  There are also videos made by murderous dictatorial regimes as a recruitment tool. YouTube has no problem with that. There are videos made by US to get more cannon fodder for their wars which also killed millions of innocent people over the decades. Where do you stop? I'm fine with stopping recruitment videos for war, but at least do it on principle as against the war, not just against a few particular organizations. It's ridiculous otherwise. It's just one belligerent suppressing the other one in a conflict. Nothing else.
  - electriclove 9y ago
    IMO, there is a difference between war and attacks on civilians.
    - philipov 9y ago
      A hypothetical difference, or a practical difference? Can you give me an example of a war that managed to avoid attacks on civilians?
wruza 9y ago
What do we do with those who thinks and is dead sure that blowing himself up in a crowd is a good idea? We all are able to see patterns, but seeing patterns is not what solves complex problems. When doctor cuts your rotten fingers and then it happens it didn't help to save an entire arm, there is a pattern too. What does this pattern tell us? Doc wants to cut all your limbs to be sure you're not leaving his clinic, right?
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- g00gler 9y ago
  > What does this pattern tell us? Doc wants to cut all your limbs to be sure you're not leaving his clinic, right? Yes.
redy 9y ago
It's remarkable how libertarians can turn on a dime from insisting that the free market is the highest good to complaining about censorship by private actors. Does the irony really escape them? If you don't like Google censoring terrorist videos start your own video hosting site. Feel free to focus on terrorist videos if you like. If you don't like Twitter censoring extremism and hate start your own microblogging site. See the pattern here? Stop trying to force your childish views on private actors (who have built their own platforms at enormous risk and expense) and start actually using those freedoms you claim to cherish so loudly.
Kenji 9y ago
It's simply called authoritarianism. The problem is that the left AND the right are authoritarian. The benefit of all those 'anti terror' laws is not only not proven but also largely debunked, however, you just need to instill a bit of fear in the population and they give up all their oh so cherished freedoms.
awkwarddaturtle 9y ago
> I hate the fact that if I voice anything skeptical of this policy someone will call me a terrorist sympathizer. It's a form of bullying and intimidation in order to take away once voice. It's reminiscent of the red scare and the mccarthy era. If you don't agree with our censorship, you are an commie/terrorist/etc sympathizer. It's a well-used method of silencing opposition. The catholic church used to do that to silence opposition.. You don't think the earth is the center of the universe? You are a heretic. > And its not like there's any side of the political spectrum I can vote for. Both Hillary and Trump wanted to censor extremism on Twitter. This is the problem. Money ultimate dictates who we can vote for. By the time the selection gets whittled down to 2, they are pretty much the same - indebted to the elite and the pretense of "left/right" is just a superficial distraction.

dangero 9y ago

The other day I was considering commenting in a negative way about something the NSA tweeted, but a voice in my head said, "Do you really want to be put on a special surveilance list?" That's when I realized our freedoms are under threat by those that are tasked with defending them. Think what you will about the NSA, but they certainly have not gone out of their way to make clear to me they care about my freedoms. Lying to congress, private courts granting warrants via secret constitution interpretations -- something is very wrong here. I fear the NSA as an upstanding citizen and they seem to be OK with that. Also more related to your comment the "don't watch ISIS videos it gives them power." I think it's misguided. Just out of curiousity I tracked down a couple of them online and it was very thought provoking. It did not make me fear ISIS more, but it did help me understand the situation more. Just not convinced intelligent people should avoid uncensored information collection, but there is so much being censored in the US right now and the media encourages you to not educate yourself on both sides.

nerdponx 9y ago
+1 for watching ISIS videos. I needed to understand the situation, I needed to internalize it better. I watched an execution. I watched combat footage. And I am glad I did. I now understand the severity and urgency of the problem. I didn't use a VPN or anything. NSA, come get me.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
abhi3 9y ago
>Also more related to your comment the "don't watch ISIS videos it gives them power." I think it's misguided. Just out of curiousity I tracked down a couple of them online and it was very thought provoking. It did not make me fear ISIS more, but it did help me understand the situation more. Just not convinced intelligent people should avoid uncensored information collection I think there has to be a better way to educate oneself/understand the situation than to watch terrorist propaganda. ISIS does not create videos 'to help people understand the situation more' but to radicalize suspectible people into becoming terrorists
- dangero 9y ago
  Anything else would be second hand though. Sometimes I feel the need to research something for myself and it's important that some people do that. Watching allows me to answer questions like, "What is the message they are trying to get across in these videos?" "Do the videos match up to the descriptions given by the media?" These are important questions to answer.

alextheparrot 9y ago

I get your point - we've slowly, and sometimes quite quickly, seen some of our rights eroded as a result of policies that are advertised as being anti-terrorist. Speaking directly to this policy, though, isn't your man premise that blow oneself up is bad enough in a vacuum unsupported? Many of these videos are crafted by the terrorist organizations as a recruitment tool. Wouldn't th see organizations not create them if they didn't wield at least some power to actually recruit or radicalize? I don't think arguing that line is consistent, even if I agree that we shouldn't censor these videos.

Retric 9y ago
99.9999% of people don't blow themselves up. It's not a significant issue because it's such a bad idea. Don't get me wrong lightning strikes are also a non issue, but that does not make swimming in a thunder storm a good idea. Basic airport screening is useful, but you very quickly hit diminishing returns.
megous 9y ago
There are also videos made by murderous dictatorial regimes as a recruitment tool. YouTube has no problem with that. There are videos made by US to get more cannon fodder for their wars which also killed millions of innocent people over the decades. Where do you stop? I'm fine with stopping recruitment videos for war, but at least do it on principle as against the war, not just against a few particular organizations. It's ridiculous otherwise. It's just one belligerent suppressing the other one in a conflict. Nothing else.
- electriclove 9y ago
  IMO, there is a difference between war and attacks on civilians.
  - philipov 9y ago
    A hypothetical difference, or a practical difference? Can you give me an example of a war that managed to avoid attacks on civilians?

wruza 9y ago

What do we do with those who thinks and is dead sure that blowing himself up in a crowd is a good idea? We all are able to see patterns, but seeing patterns is not what solves complex problems. When doctor cuts your rotten fingers and then it happens it didn't help to save an entire arm, there is a pattern too. What does this pattern tell us? Doc wants to cut all your limbs to be sure you're not leaving his clinic, right?

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
g00gler 9y ago
> What does this pattern tell us? Doc wants to cut all your limbs to be sure you're not leaving his clinic, right? Yes.

redy 9y ago

It's remarkable how libertarians can turn on a dime from insisting that the free market is the highest good to complaining about censorship by private actors. Does the irony really escape them? If you don't like Google censoring terrorist videos start your own video hosting site. Feel free to focus on terrorist videos if you like. If you don't like Twitter censoring extremism and hate start your own microblogging site. See the pattern here? Stop trying to force your childish views on private actors (who have built their own platforms at enormous risk and expense) and start actually using those freedoms you claim to cherish so loudly.

Kenji 9y ago

It's simply called authoritarianism. The problem is that the left AND the right are authoritarian. The benefit of all those 'anti terror' laws is not only not proven but also largely debunked, however, you just need to instill a bit of fear in the population and they give up all their oh so cherished freedoms.

awkwarddaturtle 9y ago

> I hate the fact that if I voice anything skeptical of this policy someone will call me a terrorist sympathizer. It's a form of bullying and intimidation in order to take away once voice. It's reminiscent of the red scare and the mccarthy era. If you don't agree with our censorship, you are an commie/terrorist/etc sympathizer. It's a well-used method of silencing opposition. The catholic church used to do that to silence opposition.. You don't think the earth is the center of the universe? You are a heretic. > And its not like there's any side of the political spectrum I can vote for. Both Hillary and Trump wanted to censor extremism on Twitter. This is the problem. Money ultimate dictates who we can vote for. By the time the selection gets whittled down to 2, they are pretty much the same - indebted to the elite and the pretense of "left/right" is just a superficial distraction.