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The "JAPANESE ONLY" sign was probably meant for chinese tourists. The kanji below it, "謝绝中国人", translates roughly to "decline chinese people" which is understan

The "JAPANESE ONLY" sign was probably meant for chinese tourists. The kanji below it, "謝绝中国人", translates roughly to "decline chinese people" which is understandable given their notorious behavior abroad: http://shanghaiist.com/2016/12/30/shanghaiist_2016_embarrassing_tourists.php http://shanghaiist.com/2016/12/30/shanghaiist_2016_embarrass... https://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/11/world/asia/bad-manners-china-tourism-blacklist.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/11/world/asia/bad-manners-ch... http://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2016/10/07/commentary/world-commentary/chinese-tourists-badly-behaved/#.WW8YmHXyttg http://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2016/10/07/commentary/wo...

yorwba 9y ago
"謝绝中国人" doesn't match what I know about Japanese grammar, but does match Chinese grammar. So I would expect the bilingual sign to be directed towards all foreigners. Once in English ("Japanese only") for everyone who speaks it, and once in Chinese to directly address Chinese tourists (who might not speak English).
- markburns 9y ago
  FYI I think the 绝 is only Simplified Chinese, 絕 in Traditional. I think 絶 is the Japanese equivalent.
  - yorwba 9y ago
    Right, I only copied the text from my parent comment, without checking that it actually matches the original. My point about the grammar stands, though. I think they simply wrote Chinese text using Japanese kanji. Simplified Chinese would be "(谢绝)(中国人)" = "(politely refuse)(Chinese person)" = "(verb)(object)", which is correct Chinese grammar. However, 謝絶 seems to be a noun/suru verb in Japanese (http://jisho.org/search/謝絶 http://jisho.org/search/謝絶), so I think the equivalent phrase would be "(中国人)(を)(謝絶)(します)" = "(Chinese person)(object of)(polite refusal)(make)" = "(object)(particle marking object)(noun/suru verb)(inflected form of suru)". Disclaimer: I am not a native speaker of either language and didn't have much in the way of grammar lessons, so this might all be horribly wrong. I'm definitely open to corrections ;)
    - ttflee 9y ago
      It's quite natural for a native Chinese speaker to recognize all these variants.
    - markburns 9y ago
      I am not doubting you. I was saying something simpler: One Chinese-only character is enough to show it is not Japanese.
      - yorwba 9y ago
        The original text didn't use the Chinese-only character, it used Japanese kanji instead.
        markburns 9y ago
        Ah, sorry, I didn't notice. That makes sense then.
lentil_soup 9y ago
doesn't make it any less racist
- taneq 9y ago
  Now we're entering into a debate of whether perfectly rational behaviour should be eschewed in favour of virtue signalling.
  - brucephillips 9y ago
    You think the desire to protect individuals from racism is merely virtue signalling?
    - taneq 9y ago
      Only if (as in this case) it discards the other side of the debate, which is the desire to protect individuals from harm predominantly perpetrated by a particular demographic.
      - brucephillips 9y ago
        That's just the racist side. You're quite simply defending racism. Racists are still morally culpable even if their prejudices are statistically true, because it harms individuals who don't happen to adhere to those stereotypes.
        taneq 9y ago
        I'm asking how far we should go to 'not be racist' on principle, when doing so causes measurable material harm. Is your answer genuinely "I would let myself and those I care about suffer an unlimited amount of harm in order to avoid the possibility of inflicting an unfair prejudice on any individual"? Because according to your stated position, anything less is "defending racism". And I strongly suspect that, if it were put to the test, you really would not accept arbitrary harm in order to "not defend racism". And if so, then you're publicly declaring that you hold a 'virtuous' position, when in reality you do not. And that is the definition of 'virtue signalling'.
illuminati1911 9y ago
I don't understand your logic. The English one is for other foreigners and the kanji one for Chinese because most of them can't read/speak English so "Japanese only" sign wouldn't mean anything to them.
tanilama 9y ago
It makes sense: if you can read Chinese, they told u to fuck off. If you cannot read Chinese, they still tell you to fuck off. The chinese and english translation serves its targeting audience pretty well respectively.
barrkel 9y ago
How many Chinese people would understand English text that says Japanese only?
peteretep 9y ago
I'm always intrigued in Thailand by which languages they choose to translate which signs to. In one of the big international hospitals, they have some guidelines in the bathroom: * Don't wash your feet in the sink (Chinese and Arabic only) * Don't squat on the toilet seat (Thai and Chinese only) * Please wash your hands (English and Arabic only)
- mjevans 9y ago
  As a 'westerner' I'm only really familiar with 'western' style restroom use, but the signs seem to indicate that the restroom should be used in a western way. I was aware of 'trench' style toilets existing, so the directions for south-east Asian languages make some sense. I wasn't aware of the 'foot washing' practice though... that seems odd.
mikekchar 9y ago
I'm trying to avoid commenting on this thread because I think it is impossible for me to write a nuanced enough response that will give people a closer understanding of what it's like to live here (I moved here 10 years ago, though I spent 2 years in the UK, so 8 years total). However, I can comment on the "Japanese only" signs. I've never actually seen one myself, but I know they exist in some places. An acquaintance of mine is well connected with a particular sumo heya (a "heya" is essentially a group of sumo wrestlers who live and train together along with their trainers and staff). It is popular (and fun) to go and watch the wrestlers train in their heya, but one is sometimes confronted with the "Japanese Only" sign at the entrance. My acquaintance is not Japanese (he isn't even a resident), but like I said, he is well acquainted with the heya. One time, he asked some visiting foreigners if they wanted to watch the training and they were delighted to accept. When they got to the entrance they saw the sign. "Is it really OK?", they asked. "It's fine. I've made arrangements. As far as the heya is concerned, if you know how to make arrangements to visit the heya, then you are Japanese". Living in Japan can be very difficult for people who are not culturally Japanese. There is a weird inside/outside culture where either your are inside with a bunch of strange rules that you have to follow (and know to follow, somehow) or you are outside (where you don't really need to know or follow any rules). What "Japanese Only" means is that they only want people who know what the rules are, know how to follow the rules, and most importantly, are willing to follow the rules to the letter even if they think the rules are stupid. If you can do that, then you are "Japanese enough". Generally speaking, there are few cultures in the world with the same kind of byzantine rule following culture that Japan has. Many cultures are literally morally opposed to blindly following rules. People from those cultures often have great difficulty in certain circumstances in Japan. However, if you show that you are willing and able to surmount those hurdles, my experience has been that most people have no trouble accepting you as Japanese.
- GolDDranks 9y ago
  As a fellow expat in Japan, this was the best explanation I've seen for a while! Kudos.
- bojo 9y ago
  I agree with the other commenter, this really sums it up well.

yorwba 9y ago

"謝绝中国人" doesn't match what I know about Japanese grammar, but does match Chinese grammar. So I would expect the bilingual sign to be directed towards all foreigners. Once in English ("Japanese only") for everyone who speaks it, and once in Chinese to directly address Chinese tourists (who might not speak English).

markburns 9y ago
FYI I think the 绝 is only Simplified Chinese, 絕 in Traditional. I think 絶 is the Japanese equivalent.
- yorwba 9y ago
  Right, I only copied the text from my parent comment, without checking that it actually matches the original. My point about the grammar stands, though. I think they simply wrote Chinese text using Japanese kanji. Simplified Chinese would be "(谢绝)(中国人)" = "(politely refuse)(Chinese person)" = "(verb)(object)", which is correct Chinese grammar. However, 謝絶 seems to be a noun/suru verb in Japanese (http://jisho.org/search/謝絶 http://jisho.org/search/謝絶), so I think the equivalent phrase would be "(中国人)(を)(謝絶)(します)" = "(Chinese person)(object of)(polite refusal)(make)" = "(object)(particle marking object)(noun/suru verb)(inflected form of suru)". Disclaimer: I am not a native speaker of either language and didn't have much in the way of grammar lessons, so this might all be horribly wrong. I'm definitely open to corrections ;)
  - ttflee 9y ago
    It's quite natural for a native Chinese speaker to recognize all these variants.
  - markburns 9y ago
    I am not doubting you. I was saying something simpler: One Chinese-only character is enough to show it is not Japanese.
    - yorwba 9y ago
      The original text didn't use the Chinese-only character, it used Japanese kanji instead.
      - markburns 9y ago
        Ah, sorry, I didn't notice. That makes sense then.

lentil_soup 9y ago

doesn't make it any less racist

taneq 9y ago
Now we're entering into a debate of whether perfectly rational behaviour should be eschewed in favour of virtue signalling.
- brucephillips 9y ago
  You think the desire to protect individuals from racism is merely virtue signalling?
  - taneq 9y ago
    Only if (as in this case) it discards the other side of the debate, which is the desire to protect individuals from harm predominantly perpetrated by a particular demographic.
    - brucephillips 9y ago
      That's just the racist side. You're quite simply defending racism. Racists are still morally culpable even if their prejudices are statistically true, because it harms individuals who don't happen to adhere to those stereotypes.
      - taneq 9y ago
        I'm asking how far we should go to 'not be racist' on principle, when doing so causes measurable material harm. Is your answer genuinely "I would let myself and those I care about suffer an unlimited amount of harm in order to avoid the possibility of inflicting an unfair prejudice on any individual"? Because according to your stated position, anything less is "defending racism". And I strongly suspect that, if it were put to the test, you really would not accept arbitrary harm in order to "not defend racism". And if so, then you're publicly declaring that you hold a 'virtuous' position, when in reality you do not. And that is the definition of 'virtue signalling'.

illuminati1911 9y ago

I don't understand your logic. The English one is for other foreigners and the kanji one for Chinese because most of them can't read/speak English so "Japanese only" sign wouldn't mean anything to them.

tanilama 9y ago

It makes sense: if you can read Chinese, they told u to fuck off. If you cannot read Chinese, they still tell you to fuck off. The chinese and english translation serves its targeting audience pretty well respectively.

barrkel 9y ago

How many Chinese people would understand English text that says Japanese only?

peteretep 9y ago

I'm always intrigued in Thailand by which languages they choose to translate which signs to. In one of the big international hospitals, they have some guidelines in the bathroom: * Don't wash your feet in the sink (Chinese and Arabic only) * Don't squat on the toilet seat (Thai and Chinese only) * Please wash your hands (English and Arabic only)

mjevans 9y ago
As a 'westerner' I'm only really familiar with 'western' style restroom use, but the signs seem to indicate that the restroom should be used in a western way. I was aware of 'trench' style toilets existing, so the directions for south-east Asian languages make some sense. I wasn't aware of the 'foot washing' practice though... that seems odd.

mikekchar 9y ago

I'm trying to avoid commenting on this thread because I think it is impossible for me to write a nuanced enough response that will give people a closer understanding of what it's like to live here (I moved here 10 years ago, though I spent 2 years in the UK, so 8 years total). However, I can comment on the "Japanese only" signs. I've never actually seen one myself, but I know they exist in some places. An acquaintance of mine is well connected with a particular sumo heya (a "heya" is essentially a group of sumo wrestlers who live and train together along with their trainers and staff). It is popular (and fun) to go and watch the wrestlers train in their heya, but one is sometimes confronted with the "Japanese Only" sign at the entrance. My acquaintance is not Japanese (he isn't even a resident), but like I said, he is well acquainted with the heya. One time, he asked some visiting foreigners if they wanted to watch the training and they were delighted to accept. When they got to the entrance they saw the sign. "Is it really OK?", they asked. "It's fine. I've made arrangements. As far as the heya is concerned, if you know how to make arrangements to visit the heya, then you are Japanese". Living in Japan can be very difficult for people who are not culturally Japanese. There is a weird inside/outside culture where either your are inside with a bunch of strange rules that you have to follow (and know to follow, somehow) or you are outside (where you don't really need to know or follow any rules). What "Japanese Only" means is that they only want people who know what the rules are, know how to follow the rules, and most importantly, are willing to follow the rules to the letter even if they think the rules are stupid. If you can do that, then you are "Japanese enough". Generally speaking, there are few cultures in the world with the same kind of byzantine rule following culture that Japan has. Many cultures are literally morally opposed to blindly following rules. People from those cultures often have great difficulty in certain circumstances in Japan. However, if you show that you are willing and able to surmount those hurdles, my experience has been that most people have no trouble accepting you as Japanese.

GolDDranks 9y ago
As a fellow expat in Japan, this was the best explanation I've seen for a while! Kudos.
bojo 9y ago
I agree with the other commenter, this really sums it up well.