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Looks like Electron on steroids. The landing page is nice but it's like putting lipstick on a pig - it's still a pig in the end. Also, I never understood why p

Looks like Electron on steroids. The landing page is nice but it's like putting lipstick on a pig - it's still a pig in the end. Also, I never understood why people hate native languages so much - why do you want to replace everything with Javascript? It's shit - it's a necessary evil in the browser but when the environment gives you something better (Swift, Java, etc) why not enjoy it?

voltagex_ 9y ago
Seems like .NET [1]? Plus weird build tools and binaries in source control 1: https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/blob/master/.travis.yml#L11 https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/blob/master/.tr... 2: https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/tree/master/Stuff https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/tree/master/Stu...
- Rjevski 9y ago
  "iOS and Android from day one, with one shared codebase in UX Markup and JavaScript. You can also access all native features when needed by adding Objective-C, Swift or Java code directly to your project." (from their official site) I guess their actual compiler for "UX Markup" could be written in .NET but Javascript is definitely and unfortunately invited.
  - gloom303 9y ago
    Bent from Fuse here — The UX Markup compiler is actually written in Uno, a lightweight C# dialect that compiles to native C++ for iOS and Android. JavaScript is just used for business logic and runs on a separate thread from the UI engine.
    - voltagex_ 9y ago
      Will Uno ever be open sourced?
- thepumpkin1979 9y ago
  Markup looks a lot like XAML
sosodaft 9y ago
>Why do you want to replace everything with Javascript? Because a huge number of devs already know it, so you can have your web devs work on your mobile application. That said, my company tried Fuse out around a year ago and went with Ionic instead. Partially because adapting Angular to Fuse was a lot of effort, and partially because at that time Fuse was not nearly release-ready.
seanwilson 9y ago
> Also, I never understood why people hate native languages so much - why do you want to replace everything with Javascript? Because people don't have the time, money or expertise to write multiple completely separate code bases for cross platform apps and having to keep these code bases in sync will dramatically slow down your ability to extend and adapt your product...?
- BenjiWiebe 9y ago
  Cross platform apps don't need to have separate codebases. Cross platform libraries and toolkits do exist.
  - seanwilson 9y ago
    What toolkit is going to give you an app that feels completely native?
  - allover 9y ago
    Existing is not sufficient. Convince us one of those tools is any good, because it doesn't seem like it, from the traction they've had so far.
    - vinceguidry 9y ago
      I want the same thing you want, but I recognize that such a thing is very, very hard to do.
- flukus 9y ago
  You don't need completely separate code bases, just separate UI implementations. When did we decide that developer time was more precious than user experience anyway? Every time I see an electron app now I just assume that the devs don't care about their users, just how much easier it is for them to push bloated crap out the door.
  - seanwilson 9y ago
skrebbel 9y ago
> it's still a pig in the end. Why would you say that? I'm not convinced you even looked at it longer than to arrive at the conclusion that it has some JavaScript in it so it must be like Electron. The whole point of Fuse is that all the heavy loading is not JavaScript. Basically your business logic is JS, but the UI is declarative and both the UI and the animations are all hardware accelerated, compiled down to machine code. This makes it very much not like Electron, and more in spirit like, say, PyQt or something like that. It's a bit more like React Native, in that the UI controls are native. But unlike React Native your UI composition (the "components" in React lingo) plus the animations are compiled down to machine code too, and always hardware accelerated. And to answer your question - people don't hate native languages, they hate making the same app twice.
- Rjevski 9y ago
  That's my problem, the business logic is in JS. I hate JS to begin with but I would have tolerated it if the only place it's used is for UI - but come on there are much better languages to write business logic in.
DrSlem 9y ago
Hi, Remi from Fusetools here. In Fuse JavaScript is merely used as a scripting language to write business logic & tie the app together, so it's quite different from web & mobile frameworks where it's responsible for "everything". Native integrations are done in Swift / ObjC / Java, and all things visual & animation is handled in declarative markup. Working with business logic in JS also allows us to do instant preview updates when you change your code, which is one of the few things I've envied web-developers. :) And of course, a good argument for using JS rather than <some other script language> for this is the volume of developers (and to some extent non-developers) who can use it, as well as the amount of available resources & information out there.

voltagex_ 9y ago

Seems like .NET [1]? Plus weird build tools and binaries in source control 1: https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/blob/master/.travis.yml#L11 https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/blob/master/.tr... 2: https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/tree/master/Stuff https://github.com/fusetools/fuselibs-public/tree/master/Stu...

Rjevski 9y ago
"iOS and Android from day one, with one shared codebase in UX Markup and JavaScript. You can also access all native features when needed by adding Objective-C, Swift or Java code directly to your project." (from their official site) I guess their actual compiler for "UX Markup" could be written in .NET but Javascript is definitely and unfortunately invited.
- gloom303 9y ago
  Bent from Fuse here — The UX Markup compiler is actually written in Uno, a lightweight C# dialect that compiles to native C++ for iOS and Android. JavaScript is just used for business logic and runs on a separate thread from the UI engine.
  - voltagex_ 9y ago
    Will Uno ever be open sourced?
thepumpkin1979 9y ago
Markup looks a lot like XAML

sosodaft 9y ago

>Why do you want to replace everything with Javascript? Because a huge number of devs already know it, so you can have your web devs work on your mobile application. That said, my company tried Fuse out around a year ago and went with Ionic instead. Partially because adapting Angular to Fuse was a lot of effort, and partially because at that time Fuse was not nearly release-ready.

seanwilson 9y ago

> Also, I never understood why people hate native languages so much - why do you want to replace everything with Javascript? Because people don't have the time, money or expertise to write multiple completely separate code bases for cross platform apps and having to keep these code bases in sync will dramatically slow down your ability to extend and adapt your product...?

BenjiWiebe 9y ago
Cross platform apps don't need to have separate codebases. Cross platform libraries and toolkits do exist.
- seanwilson 9y ago
  What toolkit is going to give you an app that feels completely native?
- allover 9y ago
  Existing is not sufficient. Convince us one of those tools is any good, because it doesn't seem like it, from the traction they've had so far.
  - vinceguidry 9y ago
    I want the same thing you want, but I recognize that such a thing is very, very hard to do.
flukus 9y ago
You don't need completely separate code bases, just separate UI implementations. When did we decide that developer time was more precious than user experience anyway? Every time I see an electron app now I just assume that the devs don't care about their users, just how much easier it is for them to push bloated crap out the door.
- seanwilson 9y ago

skrebbel 9y ago

> it's still a pig in the end. Why would you say that? I'm not convinced you even looked at it longer than to arrive at the conclusion that it has some JavaScript in it so it must be like Electron. The whole point of Fuse is that all the heavy loading is not JavaScript. Basically your business logic is JS, but the UI is declarative and both the UI and the animations are all hardware accelerated, compiled down to machine code. This makes it very much not like Electron, and more in spirit like, say, PyQt or something like that. It's a bit more like React Native, in that the UI controls are native. But unlike React Native your UI composition (the "components" in React lingo) plus the animations are compiled down to machine code too, and always hardware accelerated. And to answer your question - people don't hate native languages, they hate making the same app twice.

Rjevski 9y ago
That's my problem, the business logic is in JS. I hate JS to begin with but I would have tolerated it if the only place it's used is for UI - but come on there are much better languages to write business logic in.

DrSlem 9y ago

Hi, Remi from Fusetools here. In Fuse JavaScript is merely used as a scripting language to write business logic & tie the app together, so it's quite different from web & mobile frameworks where it's responsible for "everything". Native integrations are done in Swift / ObjC / Java, and all things visual & animation is handled in declarative markup. Working with business logic in JS also allows us to do instant preview updates when you change your code, which is one of the few things I've envied web-developers. :) And of course, a good argument for using JS rather than <some other script language> for this is the volume of developers (and to some extent non-developers) who can use it, as well as the amount of available resources & information out there.